MS-69 Coins Before 1950: How Many ?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by GoldFinger1969, Apr 6, 2022.

  1. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    "The Best One" -- a Saint-Gaudens Double Eagle from the Wells Fargo Hoard -- is up for sale over at GC (ends Sunday night). It is graded MS-69, one of 10 from that hoard.

    There was never an MS-69 Saint before that hoard was found. With Morgan Dollars, I believe there are about 10-12, adjusting for crack-outs.

    Those of you who collect the traditional coin series that were so popular in the 1950's, 1960's, and 1970's....are there MS-69 coins for the series you collect or follow ?

    I'm not aware of any MS-70's even with a coin series that was collected from Day 1 like 1909 Lincoln Cents.
     
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  3. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    "The Best One" would be the 1793 Wreath Cent. It took almost a century for the next 69 to appear in 1880 for Morgans. There's one 69 for Trade Dollars but its a proof
     
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  4. johnmilton

    johnmilton Well-Known Member

    There are virtually no MS-69 coins in all of the series that I collect. I don’t look for them anyway because there is no way I could afford them. Among the early U.S. coins I have really like through the years, I am super pleased with AU-58 coins.
     
  5. robec

    robec Junior Member

    Blay’s 1919 cent is the only pre 1950 MS69 Lincoln I know of.
     
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  6. serdogthehound

    serdogthehound Well-Known Member

  7. Keyman64

    Keyman64 Well-Known Member

    There's a MS69 1939 Merc that's over graded. I and others have seen it in hand. Then there are 25 MS69FB 1939-D Mercs.
     
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  8. AdamL

    AdamL Well-Known Member

    Looks to me like there aren't any MS69 Walking Liberty Halves graded by PCGS. And only one by NGC.
    There look to be 2 or 3 dozen MS68's between the two.
     
  9. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    I would guess it's easier for a large coin to have dents and dings in the fields and on the devices as it comes off the press.
     
  10. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

  11. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Not a lot of people could afford to be collecting 50 cent pieces during two world wars and a depression
     
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  12. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    By limiting your question to coins dated before 1950, which by doing I can only assume you're trying to take the more modern coins out of the running, you're presenting a slightly different variation of the basic question covering all coins. There's nothing wrong with doing that and I can understand the reasoning behind it. You want the more modern coins removed so as not to skew the results. Or at least that's what I assume your desire is/was.

    But when you start asking questions like that you must also take into to consideration the time frame, as in when, what year/s the grading took place. To help illustrate what I'm talking about, I'd suggest you'd take a look at these two posts and threads, and make note of the dates of when they were posted.

    https://www.cointalk.com/threads/whizzed-coin-or-not.6104/#post-46890

    https://www.cointalk.com/threads/pcgs-ms70.347080/#post-3719245

    And then for comparison purposes make note of what you see at this link, also provided in one of those posts -

    https://www.pcgs.com/pop/pcgs-population-totals

    - and compare that to the numbers you saw in those 2 posts.

    My point here of course is that changing grading standards, and when they were changed, makes all the difference in the world !
     
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  13. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    Yup, that's it GD. I figure today with regular coins that we use to buy stuff (pennies, nickels, dimes, etc.) you can probably get lots of 69's and maybe an occaisonal 70 (I'm not talking proof sets or stuff like that, regular circulateds).
    I will, thanks. Could have a lot of free time on my hands next week.:D
    Noted....thanks !
    Yup, and I know you are a stickler for grading.

    Just curious....have you seen that Saint-Gaudens MS-69 WF Hoard "The Best One" -- would be interested in how you would grade it?

    https://www.greatcollections.com/Co...lls-Fargo-Nevada-Gold-The-Best-One-PCGS-MS-69
     
  14. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Well the number of contact marks on the obv and rev both would preclude a 69 all by themselves. And the wear in the usual places - breast and left leg, and a bit in the fields - mean it's not even MS.

    Of course PCGS says, and says it in writing, that wear doesn't count. That coins with wear like that can be graded as high as MS67 - but no higher.

    But since they gave it a 69 that kind of proves they don't even listen to themselves anymore. Which is something I've been telling folks for years.
     
  15. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    :D:D:D
     
  16. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    I'm not doubting you, but is that on their website somewhere where I could read it myself?
     
  17. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

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  18. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    I know we've had this debate before so I won't go into the "is it wear" thing again....but you do know that it is almost certainly the case that the Wells Fargo Hoard coins simply hit against one another inside the bag and saw no actual Circulation Wear, right ?

    Of that we can be almost positive. They stayed in the bag for decades.
     
  19. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    I would probably give it a 68 myself, though if you are going by comps, I can see why it got a 69.

    I see some tiny dings on the reverse rim, but they are almost certainly from clanking around inside the bag. The fields are nice.

    I really need to see the coin under a 5-10x glass -- ideally before it got holdered -- to check out the "wear" on the high points.

    Insider, how would you grade this one ?
     
  20. gmarguli

    gmarguli Slightly Evil™

    If you include world coins, there are a few. I made this one back around 2010. Came from an original roll. A bunch others from the roll graded MS68 and MS67.

    1866FrankfurtKreuzer.jpg
     
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  21. potty dollar 1878

    potty dollar 1878 Well-Known Member

    Pretty!!!:):)very impressive.
     
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