What to accept for my gold in relation to spot.

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by Publius2, May 10, 2021.

  1. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    I have a number of 1 ounce gold Maple Leafs, Kruggerands, and US Mint commemoratives to sell from an estate. Total is about 65 ounces. I have a known and reputable local dealer to work with. What do you think is a reasonable price to accept in relation to spot?

    At or slightly above spot?

    1 or 2% below spot?

    Something else?

    I notice that APMEX is currently selling these generic, unslabbed coins roughly 7 to 8% above spot.

    Thanks. I'm a pretty knowledgeable US coin collector but not a PM stacker or investor.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
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  3. Matthew Kruse

    Matthew Kruse Young Numismatist

    65 ounces :eek:

    A Novice and spirityoda like this.
  4. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I reference the following to get an idea. This is what one dealer buys from and sells for to other dealers.


    As of today, he is buying Maples for $30 over, Krugs for $42 over, and US mint commems for 3% over. I would expect around melt from your local dealer and likely would not recommend taking too much less than that.

    Also take a look at the dates of the maple leafs and Krugerrands as some have a premium.
  5. Matthew Kruse

    Matthew Kruse Young Numismatist

    I would probably shop around and let people know that you want to sell all of them to one dealer if you can get a good enough deal. See who will pay the most and have them fight for your business.

    For example, dealer one said they would pay x above spot. Could you beat that?

    Time is money but when you have as much as 65 ounces, you don't want to settle for less.
    William F and tibor like this.
  6. fretboard

    fretboard Defender of Old Coinage!

    True, Apmex and Liberty Coin are going toe to toe on ebay right now! ;) I have never had a good experience selling gold to my local coin shops at all when selling gold, especially foreign gold. If you're on a time frame and you need to sell them fast you would have to shop around as all coin shops have different amounts they're willing to pay, at least that's been my experience.
    midas1 likes this.
  7. norantyki

    norantyki CoinMuncher

    65 Ounces!?! As Ron Swanson once said:

    " I'm actually not sure how much money I have. But I do know how many pounds of money I have.”

    Words to live by ;)
  8. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    It looks like JM Bullion is buying Maples and Krugerrands at $15 over spot. In a situation like yours (liquidating an estate), I'd seriously consider dealing with a large merchant like that. They've got secure processes in place, and you know they're good for the money.

    On the other hand, if you can get a trusted local dealer to offer melt, it might be worth a $1000 haircut to deal locally.
    slackaction1 likes this.
  9. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the input. A few months ago I queried APMEX and their offer was worse than my local dealer. Also, I would have to pay for shipping, insurance. Etc. I am very leery of shipping this material. My local is trusted, well-repped and financed and has a lot to lose if he deals unethically. Those factors bias me toward working with him.

    I just wanted to get a feel for how much negotiating room I might have with him and you guys answered that. Thanks again.
    -jeffB and ddddd like this.
  10. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Junior Member

    won't you want to do it in 10,000 dollars or less series of transactions?
  11. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    Why would he?
  12. ddddd

    ddddd Member


    I'm guessing the above was being referenced-although the $10,000 is when buying while selling it is 25 oz for gold Maples and Krugerrands (other items like gold Eagles are exempt from this). With those thresholds, there is extra reporting required (outside of the typical capital gains tax one would pay).
    slackaction1 and FryDaddyJr like this.
  13. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    That's what I thought.

    Breaking it into a "series of transactions" under $10K is called "structuring", and gets you all the attention from tax authorities.

    It's also completely pointless for an estate liquidation, I'd think -- the cost basis gets reset on inheritance, so capital gains and taxes should be non-existent.
    slackaction1 and Santinidollar like this.
  14. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    Go big are go home, and always deal with
    someone you can trust, it can cost you in
    the long run.
  15. FryDaddyJr

    FryDaddyJr Junior Member

    you'd think but you don't know. I don't either.
  16. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    Its an estate sale. I got a new stepup basis appraisal last August when gold was peaking and the coins were in probate. So there is no inheritance, no capital gains tax, no other IRS reporting or taxes involved. Believe me, I researched everything about this before I decided on the right strategy for my siblings and me.

    That said, the rules are somewhat complex and you should not make assumptions that what is true in one situation is also true in another
  17. rte

    rte Well-Known Member

    Would there be an issue with just dividing up the coins amongst the siblings?
    Providing they are all onboard.
  18. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    Structuring is indeed a no-no. I have more than 25 Kruggerands, so a 1099-B will be generated but that should be no big deal since the sale is perfectly legitimate and the price will be below the stepup basis so no capital gains tax owed. All documented and aboveboard. Proceeds going into the estate bank account for estate distribution to heirs.
    FryDaddyJr and -jeffB like this.
  19. Publius2

    Publius2 Well-Known Member

    The estate can distribute the coins directly to the heirs. It's just that not all the heirs want the issues associated with owning PM. So there is some coin distribution and some cash-from-coins distribution.
    -jeffB likes this.
  20. imrich

    imrich Supporter! Supporter

    My experience in trading PM for Fiat is that the larger the
    transaction the greater the opportunity for a negative outcome.

    Although there are laws, when it comes to interstate commerce, government state legal/judicial officials are really reluctant to pursue any recourse litigious action where there may be a possible error in procedure. A major auction house offers a seemingly reasonable effort in transacting your sale, but wants you to drop-ship to their out-state facility where terms are often changed upon receipt. Some will remember Hugh?.

    I have constantly dealt with others in "trading", currently processing several, but generally keep the transactions to a reasonable amount, as values and commodities availability are changing appreciably.

    JMHO, worth at least that paid for advice.
  21. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    This is probably a good place for me to add that I definitely have NOT ever done PM transactions at this scale myself, so I'm not speaking from personal experience.

    I've assumed that six-figure transactions are No Big Deal for companies like APMEX or JM Bullion, but again, no personal experience.
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