Silver getting crushed today

Not sure what this means.

Would have to disagree. I've noticed what people need the most they generally want cheap or free. It's an 'entitlement' issue.

Of course the beauty of fiat currency in its absence of intrinsic value is how freely it will be spent [esp. other people's currency, i.e. credit]. Consumer spending is still I believe considered the biggest economic driver towards 'prosperity'.

I'm not sure how one would do that, as they are exact opposites. Denominations are 'assigned' just like values on stamps. It's just numbers.

 

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That it's value is intrinsic upon creation.

That's true but that still doesn't change the fact that things that some people want to call "real money" have no value other than the value assigned by humans based off of actual real money.

Only a very small percentage of people don't think money has a value. No one says I'd rather spend this because it's not silver. The reason silver coins get pulled from circulation is because they're worth more than face aka it's free money to keep it. If they were worth face only they would be spent just as freely as non-silver.

It isn't fiat money that makes it spent easier, it's credit. You can buy now and pay later.

 

Yes 'perception' is almost everything. But perceptions change.

Let's take a gov't minted bullion coin. Say it has 3 major values: its intrinsic value, its assigned value [denomination], and it's PM/dollar ratio value. By 'intrinsic' we could generalize and say 'usefulness'. PM's have a lot of specialized and often indispensable uses that would most definitely expand in scope if not so 'costly' an ingredient. The supply is small also, relative to iron.

I don't think anyone believes fiat currency has no value. I just think spending can accelerate in proportion to how detached that currency is from something of intrinsic worth, at least on a psychological level - such as cash/check/card/digital progression. Even cash is more physical than a debit transaction. But the increase in spending could be purely coincidental.

No one wants to be a sucker for the bullion hawkers, but they buy as much as they sell, and just want the margins, like anyone else. It's not snake oil. Ads are just like ads for any other product. You buy it or you don't.

 

Actually, a large percentage of the population would spend US Currency as face value whether it was based on non-PMs or PMs. It's those people who identify the PM in the coinage that pull it from market.

If you take that old quarter or half dollar to a bank they'll give you face value, not it's PM value. You have to go elsewhere for that.

 

Exactly. My point was it isn't some magical intrinsic value for why the coins are pulled or because people think they're real money like some suggest, they're just simply pulled because some people know they can make money selling them for more.

 

Absolutely CORRECT!!! Because every bit of "spending" is someone else's income. THAT is as good as any for an explanation of why macroeconomics and microeconomics are vastly different animals.

 

"Macroeconomics" is a myth.

 

Not sure I'm understanding your position? Yes, history clearly shows people can be coerced to use worth-less currency for extended lengths of time in relation to an average human lifespan. Gold and silver were accepted freely for "thousands of years".

Take the gun away from people's heads, get rid of the artificial demand created by taxes, let people choose what medium they prefer to accept and there's "real" money. Betting it wouldn't be "fiat". (lol)

 

So just abolish all forums over government around the world to see what you are trying to argue is money? In that case weapons would be money in total chaos. The over whelming majority of the world believes money is money because that’s what money is. Gold and silvers only value is when it’s converted to actual money. It’s been almost 60 years since it was considered currency

 

I would expect this oft-repeated lie from an Austrian School adherent. Typical garbage response. Macroeconomics is the ONLY economics even worth studying, yet Austrians deny its very existence.

 

Who suggested abolishing gov't? Markets, money, interest rates, etc., do you think these are gov't, or worse yet, an economist's creation?

 

No, it's an abstract creation of your mind. Macroeconomics (like a forest), is just the sum total of microeconomic choices (individual trees).

 

But can microeconomists tell an individual tree from a wood telephone pole, a shrub, some types of grass, or a artificial tree when they are summing up?

 

Safe to assume the answer is no. But the market will be fine so long as the "microeconomists", macroeconomist's and gov't, aren't allowed or encouraged to interfere...

 

Back to silver!!! It seems like the overseas markets get nice gains then the US market opens and crushes it, Ha Ha

 

Been that way for years. Almost ten years ago I read that by day trading silver you can make a fortune if you sell as the open and buy at the close.

 

Of course macroeconomics exists. It's what the Individual is expected to sacrifice himself to. "C'mon now stimulate the economy!" Save? What are you smoking? Spend, spend spend! Borrow, borrow, borrow! Consume, consume, consume! Be the first one on you block to fill your garage up with useless crap. What difference does it make if it kill's you?
"We're all dead in the long run." The least you can do is help the economy before you croak.

C'mon now let's get with the script!

 

Exactly.

 

Okay, it's pointless to even discuss economics with people (as if...) like @Danjohnson, @longnine009 and others here. They plainly have not one scintilla of a clue what they're talking about. They're clearly brainwashed and braindead Randians and/or Austrians who have NO BUSINESS WHATSOEVER even TRYING to discuss a modern economy.

To find a paradigm that filled their political agenda, the neo-Austrians had to dig up the long dead paradigm of the "Supreme Economics of Selfishness", dragged up from when we had "robber barons" (they liked Austrian economics, too), and income taxation was not even Constitutional, the Austrian School. By denying that there even is a macroeconomy, they automatically disqualify themselves from achieving even the status of "sentient beings".

If you believe in Austrian School or carry around anything written by Ayn Rand, you're an extremist political wingnut crank - PERIOD!!

Macroeconomics is a myth? Then so is medicine. After all, it's just individual chemicals.

 

you mean this ?