Return to Gold Standard and price per ounce

Gee - you might not have noticed, but the last half of the last century wasn't that bad. You'd have loved 19th Century London.

Ruben

 

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Things were fine up through the 1980's, I agree... when we began to lose our manufacturing base, that's when everything started to go bad. The '90's were a magnificent technology-fueled decade of growth thanks to specialized workers, but once those skills became less-specialized, our growth slowed. Almost ALL growth under Bush from 2000-2008 was fueled by debt, and that continues to be the case today.

This country peaked in 1998-1999. The new millennium ushered in a new era for the US, where we will no longer be the top dog, unless we get that manufacturing base back via tariffs and abolishing certain trade agreements (NAFTA!) we set up with undeveloped countries.

 

That 17 trillion dollars of world wide wealth was printed from thin air. The supposed GDP to back that is composed of primarily a service based economy, and little to no production to export. No wonder why the Chinese don't want the U.S. dollar being the world reserve currency and urge their citizens to buy silver bullion (as we all should).

 

Printed from thin air by banks that leverage their assets at nearly a 10:1 ratio.

Completely unsustainable banking practices inflated our debt, and our wealth, to massive levels. Time to pop the bubble... painful in the short-term, but will do wonders for our country in the long-term. Would you rather see the current iteration of our country meander on for another 15-20 years of small ups and huge downs, along with the death spiral that is hyperinflation when we inevitably lose the backing of OPEC, or do a quick number that will probably result in another depression and huge unemployment for, say, 10 years, followed by long-term prosperity that should secure the safety of our country for the next century or two?

Don't think about what's best for you today, think about what's best for your children, their children... the future of our country. If you can do that and openly advocate a continuation of the FIAT system, you're out of your mind.

 

Mines 2 months and already has $43,000 of debt thanks to the U.S. government. Time to stop giving the addicts their daily dose. Instead of putting money away in a bank for my sons future, I'm saving silver (god's money) so that something will be there for him down the road.

 

http://www.learner.org/vod/vod_window.html?pid=860

 

You weren't alive in the 1980's so I doubt you have a reference. But as a fact, the economy did much better from the mid-1990s through to about 2008.

Ruben

 

Born in '86. And the '80's was when our manufacturing base started to decline... did you even bother to read the rest of my post? I addressed the '90's and 2000's in there...

 

Aside from being wrong, you also realize that your way into politics at this point.

 

How did I guess that ... huh..

 

How much do you want to wager on that? Since you believe that the 1980's marked the decline of our manufacturing base, and you KNOW SO MUCH about economics, you should have no problem making a little wager on that.

Ruben

 

You better pay it up RIGHT awys or a Chinaman might be knocking at your door next week trying to collect...

Ruben

 

http://www.learner.org/vod/vod_window.html?pid=864

 

Alright, I'm gonna use the multi-quote feature here since you just can't get anything about proper forum etiquette CUT IT OUT PERSONAL ATTACKS ON MEMBERS ARE NOT BE ALLOWED.

I'm wrong? How am I wrong? Did I just imagine the dot-com boom of the late '90's that helped our country recover from the recessionary economy that existed when Clinton took office? Don't just state that I'm wrong, back it up.

I'm pretty sure the fact that I'm fairly passionate about my beliefs gives away my age. I've also stated it elsewhere on this forum. I find it funny that, despite my 23 years of age, I'm decades wiser than you, no offense intended.

On a more personal note, I see you're a pharmacist, and a computer programmer. I work in retail management, but what I haven't mentioned on this forum yet is that I'm also pursuing a Masters in fields closely involving economics. I think I understand the reasons behind our recent failures far better than you ever will.

By the way, I will continue to hold my opinion that you are an UNCALLED FOR if you can't figure out how to post properly. You clearly have some semblance of intelligence... why not use it to present an organized counterargument?

 

Just like the "Roaring Twenties", an economy inflated artificially and the population buys into it. Except from the mid 1990's to 2008 there wasn't much exported, but a LOT consumed. That's like working 2weeks a year and living the rest of the year on credit cards.

 

There is nothing cute about your ignorance on this matter. The banks don't print the money. The Treasury does and it is distributed as needed by the Fed. The monies investing in the Fed, what you call the debt, sustains the value of our money since it is purchased in US Dollars, and PAID back in US Dollars over time. You don't know enough bout asset ratios, accounting for finance to discuss them, which is why your so quite to try to hide under a rock. Needless to say, that the 17 trillion dollars that was proposed to be vanished would not only likely directly cause you to starve, and to become homeless, but your likely to still be drafted into the the inevitable war that would follow from the economic crisis and global depression.

Yeah right. We tear for you. The fact that we've had the longest run of banking stability over the last 70 years in the time since we've abandoned the Gold Crisis is just another minor inconvenient truth. Nor is the fact that we have eliminated the constant fear of runs on the bank that plaqued the world prior to that time an effective argument either. THE US IS IN DEBT.

Like anyone who REALLY knows anything about money and manages it could care less.

Speak for yourself because that does not describe the national economy, or the world economy. Huge downturns? Like where? Times are tough. You've never lived through a difficult economic period in your lifetime. You have no idea what real suffering is because it has NEVER happened in your lifetime.

Yeah yeah OPEC will eat us and everything is being sold out to the Trilateral Commission in a massive world consipiracy lead by the Private Organization called the Fed. ANd who knows what roll the Free Masions play in all of this.

Hah - do you HAVE children?

You sound like Napoleon. Viva Le France.

Ruben

 

proper forum ettiquete also calls for not insulting other people as well but lets not let that get in the way.

Don't be so inclinded to jump on that bandwagon. the recession of the late 80's was already on it's way out before clinton took office. it was the policies of reagan and somewhat bush sr. that the dot.com boom was even able to occur.

clinton's entry into office was probably the best timing a president could have. he entered office on the upswing and left on the down swing.

however if you actually look at economic growth under clinton it failed in comparison to reagan.

the dot com explosion was more of a hinderance more so in 2000 than when it started as companies found out that well these internet sites weren't all that profitable.

He is not the one saying we should just default on all debt etc...

that is just not possible. yes we could do that but not only would that send the world into a global economic depression that it has never seen that would also cause major problems for the US economy.

the dollar would devaluate to the point of non-existance. even if you backed it up with Gold (please note most of the gold in the US is foreign owned). no one would think twice about accepting it. the only place it would be good in would be the US.

we would lose almost all of our trade agreements and the manipulation of the gold market would be such that we would never recover.

there is a way out of this mess but it involves a lot of scrimping on the governments part.

PS military spending isn't even the biggest expense of the federal budget. SS/Medicare/Medicaid and welfare comprise over 50% of the US budget in mandatory spending. in 10-20 years it will consume almost all of US spending that there is.

if you want to save our country you have to first revamp the over extension of government social programs and revamp the horrible system that we call SS and medicare, and that is only a start.
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Well if this is the "Roaring Twenties" and it is not, not that it matters to you since you make up anything that crosses your mind as long as it conforms with your world view that the world is coming to an end and America is lost...

But if it IS the Roaring Twenties, its been roaring now for about 20 years, starting in the early-1990's for the current economic expansion, and after this minor crisis, it projects to continue for about another 15 years. But if I was you, I'd get off the boat now and run to China, or Kuwait...since your certain that we everything is collapsing and we will all be ruined.

Ruben

 

Ahh, after finding this page, I understand your position more;

http://www.mrbrklyn.com/

You're what? 47ish? Near your peak earning power, if not at your peak earning power. I can see why you're so vehemently against a return to any real currency... the complete wipeout of wealth would devastate you when you're so close to retirement. You're allowing your own greed to cloud your view of what's best for a country that has given you so much.

 

Ruben doesnt know what FIAT currency is, so we should not confuse him. He still thinks that the Treasury prints the money too. (I want some of what he's on). 70 years of a non-gold backed currency is near its end. During that 70 years, there has been more economic turbulence than the previous 120 years of ZERO INFLATION. I don't know what history books and what country's money he's talking about, but it sure isn't the United States of America's.