Oh no, you mean a metal conspiracy group made stuff up??

Who exactly said that, I see no one that made such a claim. I am also missing the point how even if a company does not always act in the highest ethical standards, how that automatically translates into market manipulation. It does not. There are a lot of easier ways to steal a buck. Market Manipulation is risky buisness, just ask the Hunt Bros.

 

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Always good to come back here and see the debating still going strong regarding this topic of manipulation and investment banks. As for me, I have always looked at this and simply go back to the old saying that "If You`re not cheating, You`re not trying." Ever since Glass-Steagall was repealed this was to be expected......and even that had its loopholes that We seldom hear about. (and yet it was still far more effective than Dodd-Frank, which promised "accountability AND transparency")

I try to be objective when I form opinions in my life, and with that said I would be naïve to think that the big pushers of PMs would not be doing some "shady" things as well. But as far as the banks go, one would have to be really clueless not to see what power they actually have on the global stage. Perfect case in point was Gordon Brown back in 99-02 dumping Britain`s gold. Mr. Brown vehemently denied allegations that it was done to bail out Goldman Sachs, (one can Youtube His interviews) only to find out that it was indeed true. After that, how can one underestimate the power of the "investment" bank on the global stage?

 

There is a lot of animus in the debate over PM manipulation. I have said before that I have taken a hit, like many, with the drop in PM prices, but at the end of the day it is my responsibility in making the decision over where I put my money. So I won't fault GATA, YouTube fanatics, or the local salesman. I do think that even when people are essentially wrong, they may have good points. Personally, and I don't care to beat this dead horse, I don't think there is a conflict between buying PMs and believing their prices are manipulated. PM investors are taking a gamble, from their perspective, that the manipulation -- or at least the manipulation downward -- will soon end.

I have said that the PM market is probably rigged, but not in a manner that distinguishes it fundamentally from other markets. This rigging is probably illegal, but that's the nature of the world and it's simply part of the information we must filter when we make personal decisions. Though the odds are more stacked against the individual investor than ever, it probably means only the very brightest will make big returns in the face of insider trading, manipulative algorithms and unlimited capital from competitors in a zero-sum game. It's like poker: generally, there is an advantage for the person with the most chips.

 

You know the main reason I bristle at the whole "the market is rigged" thing? Its basically your point. If it stays rigged, then it will never matter, right? But, if you are simply betting it will become unrigged, then I think that is a very dangerous bet.

The whole "the market is rigged" crud is a red herring. Who cares? There are a number of good, sound, reasonable reasons to invest in PM. Look at them, see at what price it makes sense to buy at. Look at what benefir it will have to your whole portfolio. Those are SOUND reasons to invest in PM like I have. If you try to make your investment decision based upon "manipulation", then nearly any price can be justified, if you are betting this "manipulation" will end. People here on CT a few years ago, with a straight face, were predicting $120 silver "in the near future". A LOT of them got very mad at me for disputing that assertion. I do not think my personality is innately such a SOB, but I might be the most hated poster on the PM forum because I refuse to believe this assertion, and will say so.

Basically, I am saying there is firm ground on which to base your investment decision with pm. You do not have to try to build in on the quicksand of "market manipulation". If you buy pm and some day it goes up because of that reason, whatever, its a bonus, but please do not bet your future on that premise.

 

If the market is being manipulated and you know who and why - what other information do you need?

 

But that includes the idea that there were sound reasons why gold moved from under $300 up to 1800+. What if that was the manipulation also and now a downward trend will occur until we reach a much lower level of PM support 'naturally' without manipulation?

This is a subject which will never be settled on a mixed board, as few if none of u have the financial resources to play with the manipulators( if there are any) or be one ourselves. If you can afford to buy/sell/trade multiple PM contract levels without margin, then you may qualify. Otherwise we go by faith , or we mimic the moves of the 'real' manipulators if one wishes.