Just got this email from JM Bullion after purchase of 1 OZ Gold Krugerrand

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by mpcusa, Jun 12, 2017.

  1. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ RE-MEMBER

    It was a 1oz. gold Krugerand. (in post title)
     
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  3. Speedbump

    Speedbump Not a New Member

    Good observation...

    This would not be taxable under most interpretations of the law. It would seem JMB is blocking all Nevada sales outright until they resolve the issue.
     
  4. scottishmoney

    scottishmoney Bammed

    If I were you I would think the same thing. If they cannot settle their tax issue before selling a coin I would avoid them since they haven't a clue as to what they are or are not doing.
     
  5. desertgem

    desertgem MODERATOR Senior Errer Collecktor Moderator

    Ariz. seems to have become more aggressive on taxes. Before last year our Ariz. rental investments were still by US Tax laws not making a profit, so we only had to pay taxes in Ca. But a couple of years ago, we were notified that we had to file Az. state taxes even though we owed none. So we did file. A Turbotax support person said this was becoming common. Some internet or mail order auto purchasers or sellers have ran into the same situation I read. So they may have thought they were doing right, and some complaint was filed by a customer that awaken the tax bureau.
     
  6. scottishmoney

    scottishmoney Bammed

    Most if not all states are getting a lot more aggressive on collecting sales taxes particularly with internet sales. Brick and mortar store sales tax collections are declining with the growth of internet sales.
     
  7. Speedbump

    Speedbump Not a New Member

    Nevada's rule on bullion sales tax is not cut and dry. Some choose to just apply sales tax to everything that might fall under the taxable classification. Others will choose to interpenetrate the language differently and only apply sales tax certain things. JMB has been operating in Nevada just fine without issue for many months now (maybe a year or more? not sure). Something has happened, likely a complaint of some sort, that they need to iron out before they can continue. I cant fault them for anything at this point. They tried to offer the best option for buyers to the extent allowed by law as they understood it. Nothing wrong with that. They could have a massive back tax bill they need to pay that they don't want to add to at this time, or they don't want to collect taxes only to have to refund them later if its determined that taxes didn't apply



    The issue as I understand it from speaking with Nevada store front shops...

    NAC 372.170Coins and stamps; bullion.


    1.  The tax applies to sales of coins or uncancelled stamps at a premium price for purposes other than use as a medium of exchange or postage. The tax does not apply to sales of coins or uncancelled stamps, even though sold at a premium price, if the purpose of the use of the coins or stamps is as a medium of exchange or postage.


    2.  If the sales price exceeds the face value of the coins or stamps by 50 percent, they will be deemed to have value as collectors’ items and will be taxable. If the sales price does not exceed the face value of the coins or stamps by 50 percent, they will be deemed to have value solely as a medium of exchange or postage and will not be taxable. Sales of any coins not currently accepted as money and sales of cancelled stamps or stamps not currently accepted for postage are taxable.


    3.  Sales of coins to gaming establishments at any price for use in gaming operations are not taxable, except that, sales of coins at a premium price to gaming establishments for purposes other than use as a medium of exchange are governed by subsection 2.


    4.  The tax applies to sales of bullion at a premium price for purposes other than use as a medium of exchange. The tax does not apply to sales of bullion, even though sold at a premium price, if the purpose of the use of the bullion is as a medium of exchange.



    What the law does not do is differentiate between bullion and bullion coins. Item 4 exempts bullion from sales tax, but item 2 clumps coins [in general] into a taxable category. Item 1 seems to exempt certain coins, but that exemption is negated by the 50% rule in Item 2. Some dealers have tried to use the argument that bullion coins are produced and sold as bullion and should not be taxed. The face value is superficial and has zero influence on the value of the coin (lest gold drops to below $50 and silver to below $1). However, some people, including the state, may see it differently. It gets more foggy with circulated common date silver dollars, gold eagles, and junk silver when they are sold as "bullion". This is where I think JMB is getting stuck. They have not been collecting sales tax on anything because they did not think they should have to. Someone has probably raised the question, should they be...? If they do owe taxes, they probably owe a lot at this point and will probably fight it.
     
  8. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Cheap B-Tard

    every now and then even a private seller on eBay will charge tax! They do that just for the extra 9% here in CA, goes right in their pocket.
     
  9. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    the evidence, is i didnt get the coin for the price quoted, and now i had to go elseware and pay a much higher premium for the exact same thing its just not cricket !
     
  10. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    2017 1 OZ Gold Krugerrand with 50 privy :)
     
  11. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    They do business in all 50 states and probably the world, they should get there act together before selling the email i got (the one posted) leaves a real sour taste in my mouth :(
     
    kkathyl0 likes this.
  12. Jason.A

    Jason.A Active Member

    That's not evidence of their intention.
     
  13. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    I look at the end result, bottom line they should take care of any and all selling
    Issues before selling or at the very least post some sort of disclaimer for the
    State saw none of this :(
     
  14. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ RE-MEMBER

    I like that you said you "had" to pay $80 more somewhere else. :)
     
    Insider likes this.
  15. Jason.A

    Jason.A Active Member

    Yes, they should do all of those things. The fact that they did not do those is not evidence that they were out to screw you because of the price of the coin increased slightly between when you bought it and when they refunded you.

    You can't go around slandering another person or company by ascribing negative intentions to their behavior unless you can prove it.

    Stick to the facts.
     
  16. Santinidollar

    Santinidollar Supporter! Supporter

    Face it, guys. Most of us have dodged enough sales taxes on the Internet to make a sizable dent in the national debt. The days of not paying sales taxes on Internet purchases is going to end -- probably a lot sooner than we think. There is simply too much tax revenue escaping from the states -- all of which need the money.
     
  17. Speedbump

    Speedbump Not a New Member

    The end result of all this is, they are likely going to start charging sales tax on most all coin and currency products (bullion or otherwise), in which case, you aren't going to be buying from them anymore anyways.

    JMB is a great business and as a Nevada resident who has purchased many things from them, I have no reason to suspect there is anything malicious going on.
     
  18. jmbullion

    jmbullion New Member

    Hi all,

    Just wanted to provide some clarification here. As mentioned, our fulfillment center/inventory is currently in Nevada where there are some uncertainties regarding the sales tax of precious metals, which makes accounting practically impossible. As a result, we have suspended sales and are clarifying things with the state which will obviously take some time. We do hope to resume Nevada sales in the future.

    On jmbullion.com, we are able to prevent customers with a Nevada shipping address from checking out all together. However, on our eBay store, which I assume is where the 1 oz Krugerrand was purchased, we are not able to block specific states within the US. We have recently added a message clarifying this on all our product listings, and hopeful this will prevent Nevada residents from ordering. If not, the order will be canceled and a full refund will be issued.
     
  19. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    It is what it is, i guess either pay the toll or go home..LOL
     
    kkathyl0 likes this.
  20. kkathyl0

    kkathyl0 Active Member

    @jmbullion good luck hope all works out in the end for you.
     
  21. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    Not trying to screw or slander anyone lets be clear on that , just stating my experience is all !!
     
    kkathyl0 likes this.
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