Investing in Bullion?

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by Jscraton, Feb 3, 2018.

  1. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member

    I have a couple questions pertaining to bullion investments.

    1. Once you have an investment, when it's time to sell who do you sell too? A shop, smelter, another investor?

    2. Who would be the best to buy from when it comes to online and smooth transactions?

    I've been watching the markets for the past few years, and although they haven't done anything spectacular I do have a hunch if I invest now I'll be happy I did down the road at some point. Only question is who to sell to, and who to buy from. I've been looking at Apmex and Provident so far.

    Thanks in advance!
     
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  3. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Well-Known Member

    I collect silver, gold and platinum; not really as an investment but because it looks pretty. lol I started buying ASEs, AGEs and APEs (Silver, Gold & Platinum eagles) back in 97 and although they have risen in valuation they pale in comparison to many other investments. There are certain years where they spike. If you bought before the spike and not during and sold at it's highs were you good.

    But in selling PMs it's best to sell it to another PM buyer to maximize you profits.

    As you may have noticed in Provident, if you buy Silver they have a buyback price which is below the selling price. This price excludes you Shipping the product to them. So you have to add in your shipping price to the overall cost. If you store your PM in say a Safety Deposit Box you should also add the cost of storage of your PMs to it's overall valuation.

    Since many buy small if you buy above $100 Provident Metals and Apmex are good places as they include free ground shipping.

    If you buy certain fancy rounds. You'll pay a premium. You'll have to find a specific buyer that likes the design. Otherwise many think a round of silver is just that, silver and won't want to pay a premium. There are many exceptions and many value certain stamps, etc differently.

    Dealers will give you spot or spot minus a little. It won't matter much if it's plain silver, an ASE or a Proof ASE. They'll think of it as just silver. of course on the back end they'll sell a Proof ASE for it's retail price. There are exceptions of course.

    Then there's markets such as eBay or Facebook, etc where you are more likely to get more for it, but then pay fees on the backend. You can also buy on those markets.

    As to places to buy from it really depends. Some online places have special sales which are great. Or a certain discount code, etc. So you have to watch out there on who has low prices. Depending upon how many you buy you also have to look at their shipping costs.

    Unless PMs spike I have no interest in selling my collection. Notice I use the term "collection" and not "investment." Back in 2011 I kept everything. I consider PMs a part of my entire portfolio, and even though the prices spiked I didn't sell as I didn't know what to do with the cash. I'd want to buy PMs with it .. lol .. no reason to sell then. I should have sold and bought stocks/mutual funds, that investment would have paid off nicely by comparison.

    As the charts below can show you PMs have mostly been going on a downwards trend over the last several years after spikes. Palladium being a recent exception.

    BTW, you mentioned Provident and APMEX. you'll have to watch prices closely. I think Provident is usually lower in ASEs than APMEX. BUt with gold Eagles they flip-flop. With Platinum APMEX seems consistently lower. But who knows over longer periods of time. It's always comparison shopping.

    Silver
    [​IMG]
    .
    Platinum
    [​IMG]
    .
    and here's Gold
    [​IMG]
    .
    Palladium
    [​IMG]
    ..
    Rhodium
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
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  4. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Well-Known Member

    FYI, there's also silver/gold /platinum /palladium etc rounds, bars, junk silver which others are much more astute at that as I don't touch it. You weren't specific on what types of PMs you were going to "invest" in.
     
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  5. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member

    I'm glad you brought up the collecting aspect because I felt like a dork for not mentioning that on the other hand I just want a collection of precious metals, I'm weird and would just like to look at them and show them off when the chances arose. But at the same time I am interested in buying items that will hold their value and not be top difficult to get off if/when I decide or have to get rid of it.

    I was also wondering what kind of bullion would be best to buy as far as rounds, bars, or coins go. I'm honestly quite interested in having bars myself, but there are rounds and coins I'm interested in as well.

    Correct me if I'm wrong, but we're you saying that the rounds can be harder to get rid of because the design some have may not be ideal to certain collectors? Or just because rounds tend to cost a little extra because of the design so it's harder to get your money's worth?
    Thanks again!
     
  6. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member

    And just as a side note, I'm not doing this to like bank out or put all my money into metals in hopes the market rises when I'm 50! I've always wondered about precious metal investment and collecting as a side hobby, something to do with my hands. That and it'd just be cool to have someone hold a gold bar and tell them how much money they're holding.
     
  7. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    My advice, keep it simple, since you are just a beginner start small ASE,S are the
    logical choice but you can expand to bars, i like 10 OZ bars and am building a
    Johnson Matthey collection/investment they do come with a premium but worth
    every penny, here are a couple of my examples, though i do have several Gold coins
    Kruggers, Eagles in both 1/10 and 1 OZ sizes like the bars the best .


    [​IMG]


    [​IMG]
     
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  8. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

  9. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    They also have some poured bars as well

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Garlicus

    Garlicus Debt is dumb, cash is king.

    We occasionally post deals that we find here https://www.cointalk.com/threads/deals-freebies-and-other-exclusive-offers.290636/page-13

    Don't think anyone has mentioned it, but stay away from graded/slabbed bullion coins, for the most part. The premium on them isn't worth the cost. That being said, I do buy some graded gold bullion as an assurance to myself and the future buyer that it is legit, as long as I am not paying more than $10 or so, above what a raw coin would cost.

    I would also recommend buying in bulk (tubes of 20 Silver Eagles) vs buying single coins.

    One way to cover PM investing and collecting is to buy "junk silver" and put sets together and/or look for varieties/errors/etc...

    Also, some of the "major players" (Provident, JM Bullion, Apmex) have better deals on ebay than what they are offering on their sites.
     
    Last edited: Feb 3, 2018
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  11. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member

    Thanks! I've never cared too much for things in graded conditions, of course I like nice looking stuff, but I don't see the point in paying extra for a fancy slab for the most part.

    I do plan/already have some junk silver I'm looking to expand on, it's nice to have. Ive always been a bulk buyer too so no problem there.
     
  12. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member


    Thanks for sharing the pics, I like these poured raw looking bars. Not as shiny as the others, but looks medieval to me :rage:
     
  13. SilverMike

    SilverMike Active Member

    Several dealers offer initial lots at spot for new customers. It is a good way to get relatively cheap silver if you can catch it when spot dips. Sometimes it is a 10 ounce bar, ten silver rounds, some world bullion, or even some junk silver. Offers vary. Scroll back through the link above to the "deals" thread for more info.
    Caveat: obviously the incentive for them is to get your contact information. I set up a separate email account to use for such purposes to minimize the spam.
     
  14. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Well-Known Member

    Well, that's the $10,000 question. How is the economy going to be like when you want or need to sell? How are PM prices then versus when you bought? How badly or not are (say LCS) going to pay spot minus premium for them ??

    A few years ago when the economy collapsed I needed to sell some PMs. I basically got ripped off but there wasn't much I could do about it. Few dealers around here mess with Platinum back then, and I needed the money quickly. The quicker you need the money the more likely you'll lost money from spot price. But also in a bad economy there may be less buyers for a particular special coin, bar, etc at spot + premium ... so that's the $10k question.
     
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  15. Bman33

    Bman33 Well-Known Member

    Don't forget gold!!! If you have to go fractional due to budget then look for deals online. They are out there.
     
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  16. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    The really cool thing i like about poured bars is each one is unique, and never the
    Same, and yes they have that rustic look which is awesome as well :)
     
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  17. TheFinn

    TheFinn Well-Known Member

    I know it is tempting, but don't let people know what you have and where. Most robberies occur by family, friend or friend of those two.
     
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  18. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER" Supporter

    My collection is insured by GLOCK and many others. just go to the thread in
    General Topics under "does anybody in here shoot" you will see what I mean :)
     
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  19. TheFinn

    TheFinn Well-Known Member

    How well does that work when you're not home?
     
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  20. Jscraton

    Jscraton Member


    I have thought about this, I love my friends and family, but I know how evil money and greed can make people on a moments notice. Ontop of not keeping my stuff out in the open, i stash everything in different areas so that if someone did find a small stash that's all it would be unless they tore apart my house. Def had my fair share of thieves going through my stuff.

    Plus, you never let people know how much you make/earn/have, that's just asking for trouble!
     
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  21. TheFinn

    TheFinn Well-Known Member

    I met a guy that was willing to protect his gold and silver with a pistol. He was still dealing with shooting his drug-addicted son that broke into the house to get some "easy" drug money. He felt horrible about killing his son, but knew that he made the commitment to defend his property. He was continually bringing it up and trying to justify it to himself. It was sad to see.
     
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