Interesting finds (aka where the 67s are from)...

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by ddddd, Jul 8, 2019.

  1. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    Can NGC upgrade coins? Yes, I’ve seen it, but not for 67/68 grades (I think more focus on getting the grade at PCGS because they know those will sell for higher).

    One example was a 65 Morgan that I bid on in a PCGS holder that later showed up in a 66 NGC holder. I’ll see if I can link the pictures.
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  3. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    Here is that example. It sold on Stacks (as a 65) at the end of February 2018 for $1,860 and then brought $2,747.25 at Great Collections (as a 66) in April 2018.

    FB8C0DCE-5D7A-41B1-8A0B-ACD9B10AE1F0.jpeg E7BE5DBD-B58B-4499-A133-3866B0ED02C8.jpeg
  4. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    Very nice comparisons. Now, if you could find a few that would bump up a grade...
  5. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I can only wish. Unfortunately it’s completely unpredictable. A lot of the coins, like some of the ones I posted here, look fully maxed out to me or at least not deserving anything more than a 1/2 point bump. But then I see them upgrade and end up wondering why.

    A few of the coins that I have in older holders looked more deserving but they did not receive the kind of bump up I’m showing here. Maybe I need to keep submitting, but at some point spending money on grading fees gets expensive and it ruins the fun of collecting.
  6. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    If you're in it for fun, you'll always be outcompeted by those who are in it for money, and do enough business to know the odds. ("About 80% of these are graded accurately, 10% are a point high, 10% are a point low. A one-point bump gives a $5000 value increase. I'm willing to gamble, let's see, carry the two, about 27 resubmissions to try for that bump. Let's go!")
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  7. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    It’s true that if you’re in it for fun, you’ll be outcompeted.
    And even when it’s for fun, this stuff matters since getting the coin you want keeps costing more (or one is even completely priced out of certain coins) as it gets upgraded to higher grades.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  8. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    Conversely, as grades inflate, the honestly graded equivalent specimens (that haven't yet been run through the resubmission mill) will tend to get cheaper. So you still might end up getting a better coin for less money down the road.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  9. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    That’s the hope.
    Unfortunately that’s not been my experience lately. What I’m seeing is either
    1) people bidding up some of those honestly graded coins because they are also hoping for an upgrade
    2) people asking multiples of auction results for the honestly graded coins since they believe them to be undergraded

    One of the ways to get a deal is to find a coin that has been tried for an upgrade multiple times and never got it, especially if it comes up for auction in a new holder in a relatively short period.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  10. Cheech9712

    Cheech9712 Every thing is a guess

    Thats the only way to roll. Smart kitty
  11. littlehugger

    littlehugger Active Member

    I am going to get me a hair dryer, oven mitts and make me some expensive toners.
    Just think of all those 64 nickels!
  12. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ Well-Known Member

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  13. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    GoldFinger1969 and Johndoe2000$ like this.
  14. micbraun

    micbraun coindiccted

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  15. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    It didn't get heated and the mods either didn't see it or decided not to click on the link back here.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  16. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    And the population census are going to be off because as I understand it they don't coordinate when coins cross.

    If a coin is re-graded within PCGS or NGC, do they make the adjustment in the numbers in-house ?
  17. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    But even if you and others THINK it is undergraded, the gist of this thread might not (ever) get it.

    From PCGS...or NGC.
  18. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    I don't know about that particular Franklin, but CU had a thread a few years ago where a Franklin went from a $400 coin to $12,000 with a nearly 2 grade upmove.
  19. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Well-Known Member

    Who is "DLH" and can anybody elaborate further on this thread or circumstance ?
  20. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    The thread is gone (or at least those posts are). From what I recall, he bought the $364k Mercury Dime from Legend (that had been upgraded to a top pop and referenced here before). Laura isn't a big fan of him (don't know why-maybe because he is being helped by the people at David Lawrence instead of her company).

    Dell Loy Hansen is trying to assemble the ultimate collection. The article below has the details.

    Here is the link to the CoinTalk thread about the $364k Mercury dime:
    Last edited: May 13, 2020
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  21. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    The only time populations are adjusted is when someone sends the label back to the tpg. If it is cracked or crossed to another company, there is no way for the original company to know and thus the reports can't be updated.

    That is a good thread.
    The $100k Franklin (actually $129,250) was a fun story. It started as a 66FBL before getting up to a 67+ FBL. There were a few owners and apparently it was offered in the 67+ holder for $12,000 at a show. No one bought it and it went to Legend where it was bid up to the $129,500 price. It took multiple attempts before the final upgrade (rumor is $5k was spent on all the regradings).
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
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