Copper Stacking, Anyone?

I've got some mint bags of cents and can say that it's not the best thing to collect. First off, it's hard to find anyone who what's 5000 of anything. Additionally, @34 lbs/bag, it can get really heavy really quick!

HOWEVER, if someone is inclined to buy physical (numismatic) copper near melt, this seems like a reasonable deal...especially the "free shipping" feature.

What do all y'all think?

https://www.moneymetals.com/pre-198...SABEgKA2fD_BwE&client=ca-pub-4159017740785598

 

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What use would this copper alloy have? AFAIK, copper wiring uses pretty much pure copper. Jewelry is gold or silver, copper jewelry in pretty well non existent. What would be the use? BTW, what is melt? I think that is for pure copper.

 

No. I'd rather stack lead if I'm going non-PM.

 

I know once there were things cast from "coin silver" perhaps someone could start some figurines or something from "coin copper".

 

I think this is great for the “doomsdayers” who believe that the world will go to barter in short order.

I mean. The sumerians bartered in copper, so did the early Greeks and Romans.

realistically Cooper has little use besides electrical applications

 

Pre-1983 copper cents are 95% copper. My personal experience is that hoarding late-date copper cents is a losing proposition. If I were going to invest in copper, I would trade options, not physical copper.

However, if I HAD to invest in physical copper, I would prefer numismatic copper...all else being equal. Why? ...because U.S. Mint products meet strict quality standards (by law), counterfeits are illegal (by law), and their initial quantity is known (by law).

This means their collectible value should increase over some long period of time. Longer than most of us have left on Planet Earth, unfortunately.

I find that the numismatic value of coins begin rising noticeably round the 70 year mark. Copper cents are at least 37 years old. Just 33 years to go!

Back in the '60s, my Father put away a number of sealed mint bags of Memorial cents. He had twelve bags...1959-1964 (P/D). Now I have them...and I'm waiting, and waiting, and waiting. I figure I have at least another 15-20 years to go before seeing much numismatic appreciation.

 

The problem for me is that copper valie is so low, and it’s growth potentially so Lowe as well that you’re better off just buying some SCHX or SCHW and getting steady growth

 

No argument here. I can think of many investments better than copper.

However, with all this C19 stimulus, I can see copper returning to $4.00/lbs...which would represent a 33% bump...apart from any future numismatic value.

 

And plumbing.

And refrigeration.

And HVAC.

And, unlike silver and photographic film at the turn of the century, none of these markets seem poised to collapse.

 

As far as using copper to speculate or store value -- I look at the "nice suit" argument that gold bugs use all the time ("an ounce bought a nice toga in ancient Rome, it buys a nice suite in London today").

A ton of copper cents is worth about $3K face value. If you could find someone to pay full copper spot, it would be closer to $6K.

If copper "holds its value through the ages" (except it might not) "like gold and silver" (them either), that ton of copper cents will still buy you a nice living-room set in 30 years, even if the price of the furniture has gone from $6K to $60K.

But it's still a ton of cents, and you've had to climb around them for 30 years.

And meanwhile, if you'd put the money into a couple of nice index funds, yadda, yadda, yadda.

Greenbacks under the mattress: don't even retain their value over time.

Pennies in the crawlspace, silver in the closet, gold in the hidden drawer: retain their real value (on average, over a long enough period, usually), but don't grow.

Real estate: earns returns during the time you're holding it, if you lease. May even be defendable in an apocalypse.

Equities: earn returns, and grow. Or shrink, or go to zero -- but, on average, when diversified, grow. But aren't shiny, and are no good against apocalypses.

 

I thought my dad was dumb when I was a kid, but then thought about it and realized how brilliant it was. He speculated in copper, but in a perfectly usable form. He would buy a semi-load or two of copper romex when copper got cheap. It didn't need any special connections. He went to Menards when copper romex was less than $10 for 14/2, and below $12 for 12/2, (not on sale). He would arrange with the desk to order a truck of each, and he bought a couple of old trailers to store them on. Then he hauled them to his old farm and park them until prices rose. Now, he was lucky being an electrician, he would always have a market for it if needed and could use it up on jobs, but most of the time something happened, prices spiked, and he would sell it off for triple or higher value.

Isn't it amazing how much smarter your dad gets the older YOU get?

P.S. I also remember pallets of half inch and 3/4 inch pipes in his old storage building at the same times.

 

Note, though, that he also had "an old farm". Yeah, it gives you a place to store your metal, but it's also real estate...

 

In Iowa, finding a place to park two semis was never a concern. Heck, he probably had 40 friends with similar space, but point taken. Not all geographies would have the same luxury, but the main point was to speculate in copper in USABLE FORM. Makes selling it easy.

 

Hmm, this reminds me. I should see how that FCX stock that I bought in March is doing.

Edit - Woohoo, up 15.95% in the Traditional, and 16.51% in the Roth.
Overall, I am even with where I was before C-19.
Other stocks that I bought in March: Ford +6.6%, GM +12.11%, Inseego +77% (cashed out half when it doubled), and Netgear +23.41%

 

Diversifying always helps, even with Copper (as already stated, depending on one's storage capacity). One never knows what will happen, though many will tell you that they do know (some even charge for their guesswork).

For instance, those who stocked up on Palladium a year or two ago are probably very happy people right now. I was not one of them. Alas.

 

But what could be more universally useful than the venerable one-cent coin?

Oh. Yeah. Um.

 

But, do any of these markets use 95% copper instead of 99%+ ?

 

Heck no! Or if they do, it's not the same alloy used in cents.

 

And that alloy is good for coinage, nothing else. Now as numismatic value, depends on how many are saved...I think it will be a lot seeing as how people think they will be worth more later. Numismatically, really nice Zincolns will fare better, I think.

 

I've never thought of it as stacking but I do have more than my fair share of copper cents. I also like the 1 oz. copper rounds so I have a bunch of them.