Coin Robberies

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This link sets off my Norton warning of a dangerous web site.

 

The site belongs to a former member here. I believe he did loose a large group of coins. This was years ago.

 

I wouldn't use Norton then. That is Abba's website and it is 100% safe.

 

they were give the report number and the detective in charge of the investigation. In NYC, they need to request a copy, they don't just give it out. The NYPD have been notified and the AG of Inving California, and the laywer are preparing a requests for action from the Irving PO and whatever they do. The last coin that showed up, show ed up iChicago on Ebay and the seller spent 48 hours in lock up for dealing in stolen goods. Then they ended up with a fine and a violation. The DA said that was the best they could do since it was not possible to prove that the selling knew the coins were hot. That was a slabbed half dime.

In the end, if the dealers and the auction houses aren't commited to the cause, it is an uphill batter. But anyone who knows Abba, knows he never gives in when he feels he is right.

 

I would think that most dealers and auction houses are committed to the cause, the problem is they can't pull a coin or return it just on someones say so, or give out customer information either. That is why they need either a warrant, or at least a police report with the coin clearly identified by serial number.

There are two things that the hobby really needs, a true national registry of stolen slabbed coins, fully identified including slab serial numbers, and for all coins submitted to the TPG's to be digitally fingerprinted.

Coins submitted to the registry would have to be submitted with proof of theft such as the police report that fully identifies them including serial number, and with the police contact persons information. This registry then needs to be tied into the Certification verification websites on all the major TPG's. You scan the barcode, it verifies the certification, and also automatically checks the stolen coin registry as well and flags if the coin is reported as stolen. This could be done by dealers auction houses or collectors. (After all if you are a collector and you want to buy a coin but it comes back as stolen are you still going to buy it?)

One problem I can see, and I am sure there are others, is, if a coin is recovered and returned, how do you insure it is removed from the registry? Who reports it as no longer stolen, and how do you confirm that the right person is doing the reporting? Otherwise the thief could report it as recovered and then be able to sell it. One way would be for the person asking for it to be removed having to give the police report number that added it to the registry. The thief wouldn't have that. (except in the case of an insurance fraud.)

Coins sent in to a TPG still in their slab for regrade or crossover would be scanned by the TPG, and if flagged as stolen, returned still in the holder and the police notified.

What about coins cracked out and sent into the TPG? This is where the second part comes into play. If the TPG's digitally fingerprinted every coin they slab, even if it is cracked out and sent in raw the coin would be identified (if sent into the same service as the holder it was cracked out of.) There are two problems here, Coins cracked out and sent to another service ( I doubt the services would be willing to share their digital fingerprints with each other.) and the 30+ years worth of coins already slabbed that are NOT fingerprinted. I don't have a good answer for either of those problems.

These ideas are not foolproof and I'm sure would need a lot more development, but I think they would be a start. Frankly I think it would be an idea that even the TPG's would get behind, because with it in place only raw stolen coins would be easy to market. That would additionally stigmatize expensive raw or even raw expensive problem coins. "Why isn't this slabbed? Could it be stolen?" it would drive a lot more coins that are currently raw, problem or problem free, to the TPG's to shed that stigma.

 

AT least there's some good news. Check this article: https://www.coinworld.com/news/us-c...ium=Email&utm_source=Lyris&utm_campaign=World
I just started a new thread about this. Just to spread the news.

 

Anything is better than what we currently have. With AI, we can probably track coins even without slabs. There has to be a desire for it and I don't think the big dealers want anything to do with it, and neither do the slabbers. Everyone is invested in the turn over of coins from the black market. There is no serious discussions of pedigrees, like in the art world, except for the highest coins. It is a big problem.

 

Current discussions with NCG


Det Garlick

I need the police report for this theft please


Ruben Safir

See: https://www.cointalk.com/threads/coin-robberies.246966/


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
RE:
Dear Ruben,

Thank you for your email. Please email me a copy of the police report
as that is the only way we can mark this as stolen.

Thank you,

Lisa


Lisa Berzins Goolsby

Customer Service

Certified Collectibles Group

NGC PMG CGC
p. 800-642-2646 | f. 941-360-2553
Lisab@NGCcoin.com

Lisab@CGCcomics.com

Lisab@PMGnotes.com


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This email message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and
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From: Ruben Safir <ruben@mrbrklyn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, January 5, 2021 2:41 AM
To: NGC Customer Service (US) <service@ngccoin.com>; Alison Emery
<aemery@ngccoin.com>
Subject: SLQ 1917 MS66 346529-010

SLQ 1917 MS66 346529-010

Hello

this coin was stolen from me a few years ago and I am always looking for
it. I noticed that you have in on the website and the grade is deleted?

NGC Cert #
346529-010
NGC Description
1917 TYPE 1 25C
NGC Grade
DELETED

What does that mean. I loved this coin. Was this returned to you and
reslabbed? This was part of a 40K+ heist.

Ruben Safir

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
On 6/18/14 12:27 AM, Ruben Safir wrote:

With regards to report 2014/3702, the theft of coins from Ruben Safir
from 1580 East 19th Street, 1-E Brooklyn, NY, attached is a PDF of many
items purchased from David Kahan including slab number for the coins.
This file is a pdf format.

In addition, I've started the very difficult task of identifying most of
the stolen coins. Nearely each one has been photographed and is
pictured http://images.mrbrklyn.com/coins/ . Note it takes time to load
because it is a lot of detailed images, much of it related to the main
website where much of the collection was documented and discussed at
the online coin museum http://www.coinhangout.com/

A spread sheet is started here:

http://www.mrbrklyn.com/docs/stolen_coins.ods
in openoffice format

or here in plain html
http://www.mrbrklyn.com/docs/stolen_coins.html

In addition, I have a paper copy of many more coins purched from a
vendor in California, mostly silver and gold commerative pieces relating
to birds.

There is only a handful of people who knew where the collection was
located....[deleted personal information ]

I might have one or two suspected leads. Please HELP me with this. The collection was unique and represented much of my savings. The peices together are unique, with an odd group of coins that would stand out, especially the large number of bird coins, ancient hebrew coins, and quality bust coins. Someone would notice them as being unique.

Ruben Safir

 

How much of value would you say ? Homeowners may cover it.

 

We may have had this conversation before, but my policy specifically limits coverage on jewelry, coins, and other small valuables, unless you cover them in a separate rider (which entails additional cost). From discussions I've read here, insuring coins with homeowners' coverage is almost never cost-effective; thus, the recommendations for specialized numismatic insurance.

 

NOTE TO ALL WHO HAVE READ THIS. I was advised by an insurance friend of mine that it is imperative that you have a record of your coins that can be printed out that will show all info: Year, MM, Grade, who graded it (TPG) etc. and if possible pics of the coins (PCGS & NGC both offer photos). Value and who determined value, use two systems one is called Collectors assistant and Trove Software. Both are very detailed and you can print out your inventory list using different formats. I am somewhat anal retentive and I use two systems just in case one of the systems fail. Which it should not.
Offered as info only, your coins, your decision and I hope no one suffers as has cplradar's family.
Semper Fi & Stay safe.
PS having a list to give to the police will assist them greatly and they WILL follow-up.

 

My little ones squeal and bite at their heels and my Australian Shepherd would tear at their throat. She is a trained attack dog. We need the protection as we live in the country and trying to get a deputy to respond is like pulling hen's teeth.

 

It doesn't address the problem that the graders and dealers are making it hard to recover or trace stolen coins throughout the system. The system needs to be opened and those that lost coins need to be believed and responded to. It is a crooked system as it is that protects criminals.

 

Something seems a bit odd to me...maybe it's the changing perceptions of police/law enforcement, etc...lots of questions in my legal mind here, if not trying/wanting to get too personal. Without even answering but to give thought to: Was this a burglary...someone forced entry/broke in, or came/entered the home specifically with the intention of thefting the coins...? Was anything else primarily taken or targeted...like maybe the coins weren't the main focus...? I mean, it would seem obvious to call the police almost immediately and not wait...the police ARE your friends despite current efforts to disparage them, and they may be able to piece together some print and other physical evidence not obvious to you all, esp with a high-dollar theft plus if other local/similar thefts you may not know about. Not trying to get your hopes up, but it does happen. So think about this from what you know and notify the police without further delay...the all the insurance stuff can wait a bit. Sorry for the loss...just some FYI tips.

 

Not even evidence of forced entry, but it seems they come in through the air conditioning windows.

 

As soon as it was discovered they were called. As for them being our friends, no they are government beauracrats, and lazy. For example, when we followed up the next day after the report, they refused to take any information and told us flat out that they have murders to investigate. Welcome to the NYC NYPD.

I'm certain that with minimal effort, they'd had been able to track the perpetrators which couldn't have been more than 2 or 3 people.

The police have always been lousy and nothing changes, and that has nothing to do with the recent BLM stuff.

 

That‘s disrespectful. Think about what you just wrote.

 

A 12 gauge with double ott buck also helps.

 

I wonder how many cases NYPD investigate each year?