Batten down the hatches... The waters are about to get rough

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by Brett_in_Sacto, Nov 1, 2016.

  1. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Damaging Coins Daily

    define "asset" and define "gain". Are you basing a gain strictly in monetary gains ? You can also gain monetary assets buy owning a house and taking a equity loan from it. Or in your retirement years, a reverse mortgage / aka end of life RE sell-out.

    If you buy a house you gain a roof over your head and living space. Definitely you gain something versus standing outside with a broken down umbrella for years at a time.

    Buy a car, the ability to get to/from work quicker than walking/cycling/ bus .. generally speaking and if anything the freedom to speedily transport yourself various places although at a cost per mile.

    Buy PMs. you get something pretty and shiny to look at.
    PMs from a low valuation trend analysis has consistently increased over time, but over a LONG time and not by much compared to other investments. But compared to a current savings account gaining 0.10% PMs might seem like the way to go !!
     
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  3. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    As millennials, AND a disturbing number of Boomers, have surmised or found, neither homes nor cars are much of an asset for MANY MANY people. They are expenses DISGUISED as assets.
     
  4. rooman9

    rooman9 Lovin Shiny Things

    I hope prices go up. I'm looking to sell some silver soon, bought it when it was $14-15 an ounce and I usually got it for less than that.
     
  5. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Damaging Coins Daily

    maintenance fees, taxes, not very good term and finance conditions.
    Yup, agree.

    But far better than standing on a street corner your entire life. It all comes down to one's own reality in finances and what they can afford and not to take on debt they cannot handle. If one maintains their financial wherewithall then they can get good terms on everything and it will fell much more like a positive financial asset.

    Don't buy a car at 24% interest rate AND at a weird monthly calculation !! Mine, which is paid off, was 2.75% at one time.

    Assets, help the emotional mentality and self worth. A very beneficial asset to have which can be part of a non-financial cost / benefit analysis. After all, why does anyone have a dog or cat .. PMs are shinier and you don't have to feed or water them ?
     
  6. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    The last time I financed a car, it was my 1988 T-Bird with the 5.0 liter V-8. My bank interest rate (direct reduction loan - no fancy "add-on" garbage) was 10.6%. Late summer of '88. End-of-model-year blowout sale.

    Every car since then has been CASH. I still have the T-Bird, and it runs awesome, but needs a rear mainseal.

    My ex-wife bought into the "own your home" riff after we split, and that money hole actually bankrupted her, from "not too bad off" to negative several thousand net worth in 7 years. Anything that COULD need to be replaced, DID need to be replaced.

    If what the economists tell us about work in the coming decades is true, home ownership makes NO SENSE AT ALL any more.
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
  7. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    No, United States Notes were NOT initiated in the 1960's, but in the 1860's. To wit:

    United States Note
    A United States Note, also known as a Legal Tender Note, is a type of paper money that was issued from 1862 to 1971 in the U.S. Having been current for over 100 years, they were issued for longer than any other form of U.S. paper money. They were known popularly as "greenbacks" in their heyday, a name inherited from the earlier greenbacks, the Demand Notes, that they replaced in 1862.

    Methinks thou art uninformed, sir @Silverhouse. I believe you need to read more books and fewer websites. But in the interim, since we're on the web, try this:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_11110

    I think it will correct your mistaken impressions.

    Where on EARTH do you people GET these ideas?!?!? WOW!!!
     
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2016
  8. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ Well-Known Member

    I would make the assumption that you think that renting a home is smarter than purchasing one ? One can purchase a decent home for about the same cost, or less if they know what they're doing. Yes there are the repair and maintenance fees that accompany home ownership, but,, at least you actually own something in the end. I also own an older T- Bird 1987 4 cyl. turbo couupe, good shape, and love it.
     
  9. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    Yes, going forward from here, renting makes far more sense than buying a home.

    Why?

    There is a rule of thumb in real estate - buying and selling costs eat up about 7 years of typical capital gains on homes; more years in slower cap gains times, and fewer in higher. I don't believe being "tied to" any fixed location for 5-15 years going forward is a wise decision.

    In my ex-wife's case, she bought at the very tippy top of our local real estate market, when "liar loans" were all the rage (she actually HAD a very good-paying job), and she rode the housing bubble demise into abject poverty. Bankruptcy, foreclosure, the whole bit. All she could do was "walk away jingle mail". She had NOTHING, NEGATIVE EQUITY for 7 years as a homeowner.
     
  10. Silverhouse

    Silverhouse Well-Known Member

    The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 transferred the monetary power from the United Stated Government to private international bankers, the FED is a private bank owned by private interests. The Federal Reserve is anything but federal. Doesn't anyone think it's crazy to borrow money? I am not misinformed. Don't you think it's crazy the government borrows money from an entity that prints it, and "loans" it out? My point of the monetary printing power being transferred back to the government was, then if that happens, who would the government borrow from? Themselves? I think you may be missing my point. This is why I don't engage in these discussions. The FED is not government run, and it's not a government entity. See FDR: My Exploited Father-In-Law by Curtis B. Dall. And don't give me a hard time about citing ONE source. LOL.
     
  11. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    The federal reserve IS a FEDERAL AGENCY, PERIOD!!! To say it isn't is a baldfaced lie!
     
  12. Silverhouse

    Silverhouse Well-Known Member

    No it's not Kurt. This is the biggest lie of them all. the Federal Reserve Bank is not a government agency, it's owned b private banking interests. "And that's all I have to say about that." Let us agree to disagree then. :)
     
    Nathan401 likes this.
  13. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    From the Federal Reserve's own website:

    "The Federal Reserve, like many other central banks, is an independent government agency but also one that is ultimately accountable to the public and the Congress. The Congress established maximum employment and stable prices as the key macroeconomic objectives for the Federal Reserve in its conduct of monetary policy. The Congress also structured the Federal Reserve to ensure that its monetary policy decisions focus on achieving these long-run goals and do not become subject to political pressures that could lead to undesirable outcomes. So, members of the Board of Governors are appointed for staggered 14-year terms and the Board chair is appointed for a four-year term. Elected officials and members of the Administration are not allowed to serve on the Board.
    The Federal Reserve does not receive funding through the congressional budgetary process. The Fed's income comes primarily from the interest on government securities that it has acquired through open market operations. Other sources of income are the interest on foreign currency investments held by the Federal Reserve System; fees received for services provided to depository institutions, such as check clearing, funds transfers, and automated clearinghouse operations; and interest on loans to depository institutions. After paying its expenses, the Federal Reserve turns the rest of its earnings over to the U.S. Treasury."

    Give it up, @Silverhouse, you're WRONG!

    It's time to shut down this "the Fed is private bankers" disinformation once and for all!
     
  14. Silverhouse

    Silverhouse Well-Known Member

    I still stand by my answer. It is NOT a federal agency. Despite what any source says.
     
  15. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    Yeah, you, the conspiracy theorist, are to be believed, but professionals in the field, are not. Okay, we get it. :rolleyes:

    Gotta give you credit for having stones, though. Insisting wrong things in the face of proof. Good man. :rolleyes:
     
  16. Johndoe2000$

    Johndoe2000$ Well-Known Member

    So,....back to topic, PM OR NOT PM THAT IS THE QUESTION ????
     
  17. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Damaging Coins Daily

    That was the question last week.
    And I guess the answer was YES.

    This week .. it's more of a gamble depending how far up you think it will go.
     
  18. V. Kurt Bellman

    V. Kurt Bellman Yes, I'm blunt! Get over your "feeeeelings".

    If that's the question, then here's my answers:

    Short term - no.
    Intermediate term - slightly no.
    Long term - heck yeah.
     
  19. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Damaging Coins Daily

    Don't be fooled by Real Estate people in "location, location, location" and "buy up" into a new house. Buy when you *need* to and buy what you *need*.

    I bought my current house a couple years ago.
    I *had* too, as the rent was going to go up from $1k to $1,200 which would of been close to unaffordable as my income barely goes up.

    And as you know, as a renter you are paying the local property taxes as part of your monthly payment, which normally as a rental is higher than as an owner property. So you pay an additional city "fee" as a renter, plus the owner's revenue. Around here for a ranch house that is about $100 per month MORE than owning for property taxes.

    The monthly note is under $700. Essentially I saved $500 a month by buying the house versus renting. I used a credit union and didn't get ripped off from fees, etc. I now have 50% equity in it due to continued market appreciation and an aggressive payment schedule (by me not the CU).

    It all comes down to the mortgage company and all their fees, etc. and *your*financial strategy.

    My fees were extremely low compared to a bank or standalone mortgage company. I'm easily ahead in buying vs renting. I plan on renting this place out in a few years when I purchase another house in the locale.

    But the tipping point is all related to locale house valuations, long term appreciation futures, mortgage fees and finance rate, down payment/points and anything else tacked on. If you can find a lender where all that is minimized then you're all set.

    Allows me more money for PMs in pretty, shiny new US Mint bullion releases. :)
     
    Johndoe2000$ likes this.
  20. Clawcoins

    Clawcoins Damaging Coins Daily

    we'll have to agree to disagree too :)

    I wish it was more slanted to the people, albeit there's a lot of "bank/investment" type companies out there to have oversight over. Bank/investment companies make money even when people lose it. I think their pay needs to be related to how well they manage peoples' monies, not just these gigantic bonuses for bad plays you hear of.

    Just buy shiny, pretty PMs and be happy :)
     
  21. Danjohnson

    Danjohnson Well-Known Member

    Gold isn't an asset, it's money and if you're inferring the price in fiat dollars "generally decline" over the long term (say from the Nixon Shock to present), I'd certainly like to see a chart of that.
     
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