1917 proof Lincoln??

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by rlm's cents, Jan 12, 2008.

  1. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    Is it possible that the proof die was struck on a regular planchette? Making the coin have a proof obverse with a slightly rounded edge?
     
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest



    to hide this ad.
  3. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    I just looked at an uncirculated 1934 penny and the edge was considerably rounded much more then the 1917 I have which you can only tell it has slight rounding with a loop. I am no Lincoln penny expert I am just now confused.
     
  4. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    Look at post #45
     
  5. rlm's cents

    rlm's cents Numismatist

    Here; 1917 proof Lincoln??
     
  6. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    As many have said, an MS coin that is struck really well can show great detail. That does not make it a proof.
     
  7. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    I looked at the edge of that coin and that's what mine looks like a 90 degree angle with a slight rounded edge. No bevel like an ordinary business strike.
     
  8. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    you tell me
     

    Attached Files:

    • 003.JPG
      003.JPG
      File size:
      317.1 KB
      Views:
      134
    • 004.JPG
      004.JPG
      File size:
      630.7 KB
      Views:
      136
  9. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned


    Razor sharp edge!
    [​IMG][​IMG]
     
    mikenoodle and BadThad like this.
  10. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned

    Sorry Mike,

    You can clearly see the beveled edge on your cent.
    [​IMG]
     
    rlm's cents likes this.
  11. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    I agree my coin does not have that razor edge but I wanna know why my coin's obverse is detailed like a matte proof and no other coin I have ever seen has as much detail including the coins pictured on here besides the matte proof.
     
  12. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    Is it possible the used the matte proof die on a business strike planchette? Explaining my coin or is it just one of the first coins struck on a die? Which wouldn't be rare and you would think I would have seen one like that before.
     
  13. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned

    My local coin dealer told me they did use the proof dies for business strikes. Which is also why mine showed die markers known for the matte proofs. However, I think some people will argue that. I am not versed enough on the subject to debate the more experience Lincoln folks.
     
  14. Mike Carr

    Mike Carr New Member

    Neither am I. But if it is a proof strike on a business strike die wouldn't that be rare aswell?
     
  15. desertgem

    desertgem Senior Errer Collecktor

    To prove that proof dies were used on a business strike, you would have to have a significant number of markers match in comparison of the proof and business strike. However since there is not an available 1917 MP, there would be no markers to compare. The few occasions I can remember where a proof die was used to make business strikes , there were plenty of proofs to compare with it. You just have a nicely struck 1917 .
     
    BadThad likes this.
  16. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned

    The rarity would come in the form of the grade for the business strike.
     
  17. robec

    robec Junior Member

    If you are thinking they used proof dies from 1916 it would have to show diagnostics of an obverse and/or reverse from that year.

    I'm not sure what the mint did with the discarded dies. As far as I know, no proof dies were made for 1917.

    According to Kevin Flynn, author of "Lincoln Cent Matte Proofs", a correspondence written by Mint Director von Engelken to Philadelphia Mint Superintendent Adam Joyce on October 18, 1916 exists in the National Archives. Because the mint was losing money on all proofs struck and many complaints from customers, von Engelken wrote "I am in receipt of your letter of October 17th. Effective at once, you will please discontinue the manufacture of proof coins."

    Also in the archives is a list of proof coins struck between 1909 and 1916. No 1917 matte proofs were listed.

    Fairly concise records were kept of coins struck, number accepted, total delivered, number good and number no good. The records are in the Medal and Proof book from the National Archives, Book 2, number delivered from medal room to Coiner.

    Yet with all this, no 1917 is known to have been minted........no record exists.
     
    JPeace$ and gbroke like this.
  18. BadThad

    BadThad Calibrated for Lincolns


    WOW! Thanks for finding that, I've never seen MAD MPL....amazing. So few of these were made the mint basically did each one by hand.
     
    gbroke likes this.
  19. gbroke

    gbroke Naturally Toned

  20. robec

    robec Junior Member

    I seriously doubt the 1916 pictured suffered from misaligned dies. The photo is of a graded coin taken while in the slab. The gasket covering the coin obscures parts of the rim.......and not evenly. I would be willing to bet if a TrueView of this coin exists the rims would appear uniform all the way around.

    Also the light is stronger on one side and when this happens one side of the rim will show more area than the opposing side. The coin could also be uneven in the slab which would make one side more visible. You don't get the 3D effect with photos as you when you hold the slab in front of your eyes.

    As an example, here is my 1916 photo compared to its TrueView. My photo cropped out most of the gasket leaving a smaller rim..........not a misaligned die.


    [​IMG] [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2013
    dwhiz and BadThad like this.
  21. cremebrule

    cremebrule Active Member

    I agree with robec. The picture gbroke posted appears misaligned because part of the rims are obscured behind the PCGS plastic (see thread gbroke posted). Also, since Matte proofs were hand fed and carefully inspected I don't think a MAD or other "Quality-control" issue would occur amongst them.
     
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page