Featured Roman Coins HOARD

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Ocatarinetabellatchitchix, Jun 13, 2020.

  1. Ocatarinetabellatchitchix

    Ocatarinetabellatchitchix Well-Known Member

    Friday, June 12, 1366
    The village of Tourves (France) was in shock. Around nine o'clock in the morning, children came to play waking up a young shepherd who was grazing his sheep. They suddenly saw silver coins emerging from the ground through a hole at first so small that one could barely pass their fingers through it, in such a quantity that the inhabitants of the village carried it in their purses, their pockets and even in their aprons.There were so many pieces that it took 20 mules to transport them. An estimation of the weight of this considerable amount of coins is about 5000 pounds. This is probably the oldest discovery of a hoard which we have a written and official record.

    Many Romans did not know the banknotes, the checkbook, or the deposit banks. A soldier received as salary 1 aureus per month (the equivalent of 25 denarii or 100 sestertius). So if he wanted to put away his savings, the best solution would be to dig a hole in the backyard and hide the money there. Hundreds of thousands of Roman citizens buried their "fortunes" in this way, and many of them died by accident, illness, murder before they could recover their money. Other reasons that could have led to the burial of a treasure are linked to political or military facts (civil wars or invasions) but also, and above all, to economic and monetary factors. An example that we find in the 4th century is that of the heavy Diocletian nummus which is struggling to find its place in the congested monetary circuits of the old Antoninianus and which is massively withdrawn from circulation. The nummus reductions made between 307-313 do nothing to help. We naturally preferred to put aside the old nummi rather than to exchange them for the new ones, lighter but with the same face value. Thus, each weighting reduction corresponds to a wave of hoarding. There were also hoards of votive offerings, without the intention of recovery or use, in a sacred place for religious purposes. They were generally made in order to gain favor with supernatural forces.

    [​IMG]
    Tomares hoard

    Even the "New Testament", written during the first century AD, have many references to the custom of burying coins:
    Matt.25:18 : "But he who received the one talent went away, and dug a hole in the ground and hid his master's money".
    Matt.13:44 : "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which a man found and covered up. Then in his joy he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field".
    2 Cor. 4:7 : "But we have this treasure in earthen vessels".

    So just to have fun and also dream a bit, let's overview a few hoards of Roman coins discovered "lately":
    The Misurata hoard
    The treasure of Misurata (Libya) was discovered in 1981 and contained some 110,000 nummi distributed in a dozen ceramics amphora according on their weight. So far, 83,000 coins have been listed.The coins in the hoard are dated between 294-333 AD. One hypothesis is that the hoard belonged to the State, that it was buried in an area of the cursus publicus (on the move) and that all of the people who knew about its existence died suddenly. On the other camp, there is the idea that the hoard belonged to a banker, that only part of it has been recovered, that it was supposed to be immobilised for a long period of time and that its sole owner died suddenly. Since the country was quite closed during Gaddafi's reign, it took years for specialists to be able to analyse the hoard. At present it is kept at the Archaeological Museum of Leptis Magna in Libya.

    6C54EF4C-9D0A-43AF-A80A-F97D59088009.jpeg

    Details of the hoard by period of time
    DF32E53E-0859-4E39-B667-91A776C97F02.jpeg

    The l'Isle-Jourdain hoard
    In 2011, three amphorae containing thousands of 1700-year-old bronze coins were discovered during excavations in a field in L'Isle-Jourdain (France). The Gers had already had its treasure 26 years ago (1985) in Eauze. These coins date from the years 290 to 310 and were struck in Rome, London, Lyon, Carthage or Trier (Germany). A few months after the discovery of 250 Roman bronze pieces by two amateurs, an archeology team found in the same place an exceptional deposit of thousands of new old pieces. These amateurs had not come there by chance: they had noted in a publication of the 90s mention of the discovery of some Roman coins and various objects in the same field.

    C53C3C68-E3A1-4109-A68B-B1AD90CACD59.jpeg

    AB8C7CB3-36E1-4549-99B3-FD336F4AE5A7.jpeg





    The Tomares hoard
    On the morning of 27 April 2016, during maintenance works in a pipeline, workers found out that they were digging through a cluster of large ceramic containers. The discovery comprised a total of 19 amphorae, 10 of which were broken as a consequence of the machine work. The other 9 were complete and remained sealed. A cursory examination of some of the pieces has resulted in the identification of folles struck by Diocletian, Maximian and Maxentius and some from the early years of Constantine’s reign, up to the year 313 AD. The average weight of one amphorae is 75 lbs, so more than 13200 lbs of coins has been unearthed. They were undoubtedly intended to remunerate civil servants or soldiers.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    You all know that in too curious, but I'd really like to see YOUR Roman coins from hoards. So it's time to show off !

    Tetricus II, Cunetio hoard
    C0B07391-8FFC-4C08-85F6-67C873885867.jpeg

    Victorinus, St-Peter Hoard
    930BA513-319F-437D-B113-C930BB725335.jpeg

    Claudius II, Braithwell Hoard
    2FBE5F2A-E67D-4299-A36B-37FAB7CFDC09.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2020
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  3. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    Unfortunately I have none that can be ascribed to a particular hoard. Thanks for the great write-up.
     
  4. seth77

    seth77 Well-Known Member

  5. furryfrog02

    furryfrog02 Well-Known Member

    I KNEW I left those amphoras somewhere! Thanks for finding them! :)

    Seriously though, what a great find. It always makes me wonder what is still buried out there and what will never be found.
     
  6. robinjojo

    robinjojo Well-Known Member

    I dig it!
     
  7. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    While interesting there is nothing in this report to say that the coins were ancient and not from 1366. I assume they were all melted.

    I have heard many sermons preached on many Bible verses but I can not recall ever having heard one on Matt.13:44. The next verse is a more familiar telling of the same basic parable but the "Pearl" lacks the possibility of impropriety since 44 suggests the man who found the treasure did not tell the landowner of the hidden value of his property. Under the law today, is there anything wrong with concealing information that would affect the land sale? In the UK, the finder and the landowner would share the find value but buying the land would then make the finder 100% owner of the find if returned or bought by the Crown. That would seem akin to 'Insider Trading' in stocks where a person in possession of hidden information is prevented from benefiting from that knowledge. If any here are Bible scholars, do you read this differently than I have?
     
  8. TheRed

    TheRed Well-Known Member

    Those are some fascinating coin hoards. While I have a number of medieval coins from hoards, only one Roman coin in my admittedly small Roman collection is from a hoard, in this case the Bridgnoth hoard. The hoard contained several thousand coins, mostly of Constans, Magnentius, and Constantius II and was discovered in England. Most notably, there were some wonderful Double Centenionalis of Magnentius featuring the Chi-Rho on the reverse. My coin is a centenionalis of Constantius II.
    20170528_082807.jpg 20170528_082836.jpg
     
  9. Ocatarinetabellatchitchix

    Ocatarinetabellatchitchix Well-Known Member

    This is the more recent document (1903) talking about the discovery of the hoard. The translation of the description of the coins could be :
    "all these coins, in the third type of Apollo with wheel on reverse accompanied by the letters M-A between the spokes..."

    B54AE07F-FC56-4820-A5AE-100084752EFD.jpeg
    04C608A7-122B-45A3-BC89-F31008D31323.jpeg

    The Apollo's head with a wheel on the reverse, plus the 2 letters M-A are certainly an indication that these coins were Marseille obols. Here is an example dated circa 200-121 BC. I think we can call them ancient.

    67FC9618-96BB-4E9F-B086-0423268E6767.jpeg

    Now about what happened to the hoard, your guess is as good as mine!
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2020
    PeteB, +VGO.DVCKS, jamesicus and 11 others like this.
  10. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    This source is more specific:

    https://www.about-antiques.com/collecting-ancient-coins/

    Individual hoards can vary in size from a few coins to over 100,000 coins. The largest hoard ever found was discovered in 1366 at Tourves, fifty kilometres east of Marseilles in France, when children came across some coins that had fallen from a small hole. When they enlarged the hole with their hands coins proceeded to shower from the side of the bank ‘like a water fountain’. The shower continued for some time, and when the silver was collected twenty mules were required to carry the load. It has been estimated that the weight must have been about 2,400 kilograms. All were small obols of Massalia, each weighing about half a gram. The hoard consequently contained over four million coins, all of which were subsequently melted down into silver bullion.

    And this report has even more details:

    http://www.mernick.org.uk/lnc/newsletter/V7_12.pdf

    NEWSLETTER
    The Journal of the London Numismatic Club

    VOL. VII NOS.11-12
    NOVEMBER 1987

    The following incident occurred about 9 am on Friday 12th June 1366 in the village of Tourves in the district of St Maximin and the Archdiocese of Aix on a certain public highway which runs between Tourves and Seysson. Three young children from the village approached and woke up a young shepherd who was asleep with his flock at the side of the road. As he turned to them the children saw behind him the earth vomiting forth silver coins from a small hole about the size of a small finger in the side of the road. Thinking the coins were PELHAUQUINS (i.e. lead money which they play with) they first filled their pockets and then their purses with them. The children stopped up the whole with their hands and a similar hole broke open in another part of the road close 40 by, and from this the coins flowed like water from a fountain and continued to do so so that according to the general consensus what had already appeared in the upper earth amounted to more than 20 mule loads. A certain woman came up after and seeing the coins shouted "My share!" "My share!" but as she bent down to seize them the coins suddenly disappeared and buried themselves whence they had come. Those remaining in the full pockets and purses of the children were inscribed thus (sketch in mss.) on one side a saracen's head, and on the other side thus (sketch in mss.) a cross with clear letters. They were of pure fine silver and could be said to be worth about 5d of the local money. These events caused many predictions to be made: they were evil rather than good so that God will make this future anew. Original in Archives des Bouche-du Rhone, B.4 (Viridis), Fo.9. In Provence a mule load was reckoned at 120 kilograms so 20 mule loads would be 2,400 kg. The coins in question were clearly obols struck by Phoenecian colonists in Marseilles weighing just over 0.5 gm so 20 mule loads would be about 42 million coins (! !) . Why did the coins suddenly vanish? Witchcraft was probably suspected but could this possibly be an exaggerated account of crystalline coins crumbling to powder when roughly handled? Not surprisingly this incident long remained part of the local folk lore mentioned by both Nostradamus and Eckhel among others. The full text of the document was first read to the Academie des Inscriptions at Belles-lettres on 20.5.1903 and subsequently published in the RN. (1) Blanchet also reproduced it in his Traite des monnaies gauloises (1905) p. 596, and in a subsequent article (2) associated the "Pelhauquins" with the lead tokens published from the Seine by Forgeais, and discussed the etymology of the word.

    ***

    The arithmetic of the person who wrote the second article seems to be a bit off -- it should be 4.8 million coins, not 42 million coins!
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2020
  11. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    My one coin traceable (so far as I know) to a particular hoard:

    Valens, AR Siliqua, 364-367, Rome Mint. Obv. DN VALEN-S PF AVG, pearl-diademed, draped, cuirassed bust right / Rev. VOT- V- MV•LT- X in four lines within wreath. In exergue: Mintmark RB. RIC IX Rome 10c (p. 118), RSC V 91(h) (ill.), Sear RCV V 19687. 17 mm., 2.00 g. From 1887 East Harptree hoard.

    Siliqua - Valens - jpg version.jpg


    Although I suppose that there's a strong likelihood that the vast majority of the ancient coins we own come from hoards, as opposed to finds of individual coins that were lost accidentally.
     
  12. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Quintillus 2.jpg
    QUINTILLUS
    AE Follis
    OBVERSE: IMP CM AVR CL QVINTILLVS AVG , radiate, draped, cuirassed bust right
    REVERSE: MARTI PACIL, Mars walking left, holding olive branch, reversed spear and shield. X in left field
    Struck at Rome, 270 AD
    2.8g, 19mm
    RIC V-1 Rome 25 corr
    Llanedeyrn Hoard
    Crispus 6 aa.jpg
    CRISPUS
    AE Follis
    OBVERSE: CRISPVS NOB CAES, laureate, cuirassed bust right
    REVERSE: SOLI INVIC-TO COMITI, Sol standing left, chlamys across left shoulder, holding globe and raising right hand. Crescent in left field. Mintmark PLN. Toone 194;
    Struck at London 318 AD
    3.2, 21mm
    RIC VII 144
    Bourton-on-the-Water hoard 1464-1466
     
  13. akeady

    akeady Well-Known Member

    This came from the Quidenham Hoard, a small hoard of denarii and Iceni silver coins. It's number 6 in the PAS find report:

    https://finds.org.uk/database/artefacts/record/id/634521

    Most of the Roman coins were well over a century old when this hoard was deposited (probably in 61 AD).

    Moneyer: L. Cassius Caecianus
    Obv. CAEICIAN - Bust of Ceres left, draped; above, control mark (C.)
    Rev. Yoke of oxen left; above, control mark (Γ.)
    Exergue: L. CASSI
    Mint: Rome (102 BC)
    Wt./Size/Axis: 3.54g / - / -
    References:
    • RSC 4 (Cassia)
    • Sydenham 594
    • Crawford 321/1
    Acquisition/Sale: Chris Rudd Online sale Quidenham Hoard List #6 8-Jun-2018
    Notes: Sep 17, 18 - This coin is coin no. 6 in this P.A.S. report - https://finds.org.uk/database/artefacts/record/id/634521

    [​IMG]

    ATB,
    Aidan.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2020
  14. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    A verifiable hoard provenance is always a bit of a bonus for me.

    Julia Maesa - Saecvli ex Kelly ex Elveden Hoard 2995.jpg
    Julia Maesa
    Ex Elveden Hoard (Suffolk, UK, 23 March 1953)

    Gordian III - Ant Virtus St Jean d'Ardieres Hoard 2869 .jpg

    GORDIAN III
    Ex St. Jean d'Ardieres Hoard (Rhône, France, 1995)

    Valerian - Deo Volkano 045.jpg

    VALERIAN I
    Ex Guerche-sur-l’Aubois Hoard (Cher, France, 2012)

    Gallienus - Fortuna MS ex Normanby illust 3542.jpg GALLIENUS
    Ex Normanby Hoard (Lincolnshire, UK, 1985)

    Gallienus - ex Holmes Vict Germ 3540.jpg
    GALLIENUS
    Ex Wareham Hoard (Dorset, UK, 1994)
     
  15. Ricardo123

    Ricardo123 Well-Known Member

    I no expert but I believe the guy who found the treasure was honest. I could just take it and go away, but instead bought the field and had a clear conscience. My question to the members of CoinTalk: if YOU find hoard, would you call archeologist and declare it or just keep it ?
     
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  16. kevin McGonigal

    kevin McGonigal Well-Known Member

    Richard the lion Heart of England and France may have died from the discovery of a buried hoard of Roman coins found on the fief of one of his retainers. The find was described as a great treasure and it has been said that it was most likely a Roman coin hoard. Whatever it was, Richard wanted it and his vassal refused to part with it. Richard assaulted his vassal in his castle and caught a lethal crossbows' bolt in the process. Finding treasures does not always have a happy ending. Never did find out what happened to it.
     
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  17. Steelers72

    Steelers72 Well-Known Member

    Great write up! Adding another hoard, couldn’t find an academic write up but I’ll share what I found

    Pristina Hoard (Yugoslavia): http://coins2.calkinsc.com/old_site/doc/pristina.html
    These coins came up offered to the market in the late 90s. Many still around today.
     
  18. Victor_Clark

    Victor_Clark all my best friends are dead Romans Dealer

    If you are interested in Roman coin hoards, then the 13 volume series "Coin hoards from Roman Britain" will be worthwhile. I am mostly interested in Late Roman bronze hoards and my list below reflects that. I did not list anything about volumes 4 and 6 because I have heard that there are not any LRB hoards in them. I only have volume 1 and 7-13. I did not list every hoard in each volume as some have numerous hoards, for example vol 12 has 55 hoards.


    CHRB 1. Chorleywood hoard 4,358 coins mid-4th 330-348 Hamble hoard 2,494 A.D. 330- 335

    CHRB 2. Bicester hoard 440 coins A.D. 317- 348

    CHRB 3. Blackmoor Hoard 29, 773 coins circa A.D. 293

    CHRB 4. ---

    CHRB 5. Some LRB hoards


    CHRB 6. ---

    CHRB 7. several LRB hoards, mostly Constantinian. 18 hoards in total, the largest is the Cae Bardd of 4716 plus 271 coins ending A.D. 328

    CHRB 8. 18 hoards, the main one and focus of the book is The Normanby Hoard of Roman 3rd Century Antoninianii 47,898 third century radiates A.D. 253- 284

    CHRB 9. Chalfont Hoard 6,628 coins, mostly debased ants from the later 3rd century.

    CHRB 10. 60 hoards, at least 20 of interest to LRB enthusiasts. Chapmanslade had 5,200 to A.D. 337

    CHRB 11. early Imperial period through AD 235

    CHRB 12. 55 hoards, maybe half would be of interest to LRB collectors most famous are Langtoft II of 923 coins ending in the 320's and the Grassmoor Hoard of 1422 coins ending in A.D. 340

    CHRB 13. Gloucester Hoard over 15,000 coins A.D. 270- 293. Includes two smaller hoards of Carausius and Allectus.


    AN INVENTORY OF ROMANO-BRITISH COIN HOARDS.jpg


    this book is not part of the CHRB series, but it is a fantastic addition to your numismatic library.

    "This long-awaited inventory collates material from more than 1,900 coin hoards, comprising c.640,000 coins, found in Britain and dating from the 1st to early 5th century AD. Robertson describes it as `a corpus amenable to unlimited exploitation'. Entries are listed chronologically by Emperor and include descriptions of the coins, details on the find spots, the containers of the hoards and objects found in association. This large volume forms an important source of reference for Roman Britain and numismatic studies in general, and highlights the continued practice of hoarding throughout the Roman occupation of Britain."


    lots of interesting information and fun trivia like how the writer of the Anglo-Saxon Chronicle recorded that in the year 418 the Romans collected all the hoards of coins that were in Britain and hid some in the earth and carried some with them to Gaul.

    or the story of how in 1858 farmworkers found the Cowlam hoard while plowing..."The twelve lads who were ploughing all wanted some (coins) in their pockets...you should have seen the lads reaching over the pankin, and scrimpin the money in...They said "We'll nivver work na mair."

    how about this-- did people in antiquity collect coins? Well, "In 1794, was also found at Rowley Regis, an earthen globe, containing about 1200 similar coins in silver, which, when all together, formed a complete series of Roman emperors." Gent. Mag. 1796


    520 pages, stuffed with numismatic tidbits. It's not often that coin books are fun, but this one is for me.
     
  19. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter 3rd Century Usurper

    Very interesting Victor.
     
  20. Roma

    Roma Active Member

    @Ocatarinetabellatchitchix few fast corrections, romans well known bank deposits (see argentarii)

    in a Roman legion there was a bank system, soldiers deposit they money there and were recorder in the librarii depositorum.

    after civil war in Lybia there are no info about the misurata hoard and what happened to it.
     
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  21. NewStyleKing

    NewStyleKing Beware of Greeks bearing wreaths

    The Greek equivalent is IGCH Inventory of Greek Coin Hoards which has spawned ECH, Egyptian Coin Hoards.
    See IGCH 2056 my nemesis. The problem is getting them properly published or even published at all. The Hierapytna hoard and the Poggio Pincenze hoards are 2 that come to mind. Great work was done on the Gaziantep Hoard and the Commerce: Demetrias l hoard, both fascinating mixed coin hoards-a must read for every boy & girl.
     
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