World Coin Market is Hot ?

Is there more interest in older gold/silver coins from decades or centuries ago among many Europeans, East Europeans, UK'ers, etc. ?

You have coins from countries/empires that don't exist anymore. That would be unique.

 

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The United States of American, produced their nicest coinage from 1795-1933. But when you compare that to Germany/ its like comparing a Rottweiler to a Toy Poodle. The entire US national debt could not complete a Germany collection. A Quarter of the Worlds coinage was struck by German States. Including the first dated coinage/ first milled coins/ massive AV 100 Dukaten to tiny 1/32 Dukats. Great Britain/ France/ Spain/ Portugal/ Italy all have long storied coin productions. There are over a hundred auction houses on sixbid from Europe/ only 4 in the States. Then there are the upcoming markets in China/ Japan/ India. Talking about India, they struck 35 pound gold 1000 Mohurs under Mughal Emperor Jahangir/ the 500 and 1000 Mohur/are the most valuable coins last in auction at 24 M.
John

 

I'll say just for myself, as a Southern US White American Christian Male... the coins of Morocco have absolutely no relation to me culturally, historically, religiously, geographically, nationally, or in any other way.

And yet, I'm building a stellar set of Moroccan coinage. Why? Because I think they're cool.

These sorts of specialized things do *very* poorly at most dealers, and especially LCS. They just don't have the demand for it. For specialized things, you have to either have a network of specialized collectors you trade with, or a specialized dealer. For my example of Moroccan coinage, I know that there are some collectors interested in what I collect (judged solely by the competition I get at auction). However, there is no collector group focused on this, as far as I know. And so, if I wanted to sell my collection I'd have to go through a specialized dealer like Stephen Album. If my collection were significant enough, I could get a dedicated Heritage sale, but those are for only the best.

The kind of people that are interested in this sort of material are *usually* more interested in the history, culture, and numismatics of the material.

The exception to this are the people who like "big silver" or gold coins. There are many, many people who accumulate "crown size silver" coins. Many countries in the 1800s issued coins in roughly the same size and purity, matched to the British Crown. These large silver coins are extremely popular, and will fetch a premium even if everything else from that country is ignored.

For example, the Rial I posted earlier would be a "crown size silver" and it is the highest graded - and so I had to pay a premium for it. I don't really care about the crown size, I just need it for my set of Moroccan coinage.

 

The first thing to point out is that if you think you will need to sell quickly, then you really shouldn't be spending a lot of money on coins. I assume FMV is full market value, in which case what that means is a moot point. Judging by the past couple of weeks, there has been a step change in valuations with things selling for multiples of expected prices. Is this right, permanent or lunacy? It depends on your own opinion, just as the dealer/buyer/auction house will have theirs.

There are a lot of variables to consider when selling. A general collection will likely do well with both dealer and auction house, but a specialised collection would be of less appeal to a dealer unless sold on commission. No dealer wants to tie up large amounts of money in a collection that is likely to contain a fair amount of similar material, the varieties of interest only to a like-minded collector. Having said that, a popular denomination is possible to sell through a dealer if the quality is there. A name always helps. It is not unknown for a collector to sell a couple of pieces in advance of consigning to auction if given an offer that is too good to turn down.

If I was looking to sell a decent collection, the last place I would consider would be ebay. Put a BIN price and people think it should cost half that. Use an auction and everyone expects or hopes things will go for opening bid. There is relatively little competitive bidding, and everyone assumes they are being taken for a ride. Confidence is always the issue with ebay.

 

The world is your oyster. The beauty of numismatics is that you can collect what you like and there is no right or wrong. The key is collecting what you like rather than treating every purchase as an investment.

The recent big surge in interest in the UK amongst the public started with the Olympics series of 50p coins. Some of those will migrate to older coins, while some will eventually spend them. Every area has someone who specialises in it.

Personally I used to collect shillings and halfpennies as denominations because a close friend collected pennies and halfcrowns and his pockets were deeper than mine. However, this created a problem for those pieces that were outside the collecting remit, but rather attractive. Eventually I got fed up looking at the serried ranks of mint state, but frequently almost identical coins other than the date. I then moved to a collection that was as eclectic as possible covering anything and everything about British numismatics from Celtic, through Roman to the present day. There are no rules.

 

I'm right there with you on that, the coins of Egypt and Albania (both non-Christian nations) also are core parts of my collection. My point was that most world collectors who end-up specializing in the coinage of Hyderabad (for instance) didn't become enamored with that type coinage after growing disenchanted with the high cost of gem classic silver US commemoratives.

 

I wonder if "westernization" has something to do with it too. Camping and cycling are huge in Thailand right now, and 20 years ago you wouldn't see either one. Of course disposable income and free time goes along with that and "hobbies" in general. Just a thought.

 

I think the hot market is due to the upper middle class putting their "recreation" dollars back into material things. In the past few years, the rich have been spending on "experiences" such as travel and other activities. It really became apparent in 2020 with all the travel restrictions. So some of the money that would have gone to such experiences now is going into coins. They don't consider it an investment, anymore than vacations and travel are investments. They don't consider cost, they have the money to burn and they want what they perceive as the best of what material interests them with no thought of resale. IMO.

 

Is there a site for world doubled dies? Is anyone tracking those?

 

This may be the case, but it has to be said that an inadvertent diversion into coins is a better (unintentional) investment than a holiday. The secondary market in used holidays is stagnant to say the least.

 

Its fun collecting coins, and that should be the only reason to do so.I am German, but love AV Dinara from the Kushan Empire as much as a Dukat from Regensburg/ My collection spans 27 centuries/ have coins from 500 Countries/ Cities/ Empires As much as I hate to say it/ its also one of the best investments I know when I show a person one of my coins/ they admire the coin for its history/ beauty. What boogles them most is, how can a 2000 year old coin still be FDC/ simply I tell them, it was never used as money....Thank God!

 

These are the coins i was tracking, sold way more than i can afford. I was going to bid on the 2 speciedalar and the 2 guildiner

 

Wow, those are some pricey coins -- and not gold, either.

What would be interesting to know would be the number of coins selling for say, over $5000 or $2500, in Europe and the U.S. that were pure numimsatics (i.e., not gold or another PM).

 

Well, the Heritage sale this weekend had 671 World coins sell for over $5000: https://coins.ha.com/c/search-resul...=Price|GTEQ 5000&ic4=KeywordSearch-A-K-071316

 

Nice, didn't know you could use their website to quickly grab that number.

So...off the top of your head...would you say that Heritage (and/or including all other online sites, including those that specialize only in World Coins).....sell more expensive U.S. or World Coins (that are not gold/silver/PM) ?

That to me is an indication of pure coin collecting/hobby interest because you don't have an investment tied to PMs.

 

Well, over this weekend, Heritage also sold 1082 US coins for more than $5000: https://coins.ha.com/c/search-resul...+51+4294944188&Nf=Price|GTEQ+5000&limitTo=all

The *vast* majority are all numismatic. There are a couple of gold and silver eagles on this list, but not many.

 

I collect coins from countries I have visited. After a week in Tuscany the summer of 2019 you wouldn't believe what an impact it had on my numismatic interests! Now stuck here in Las Vegas my only option is casino chips, an option I have yet to exercise and probably never will.

 

Agreed, but from the rich's perspective they have their wealth in much more productive investments and so are interested in coins as a hobby only. You cannot take anything with you so once you have all the material things you want, experiences give you memories.

 

That's fascinating, thanks !

Be interesting if HA had the numbers for an entire year...and maybe 5 or 10 years ago to compare them to. That way, you put HARD NUMBERS on what we are trying to figure out anectdotally or via guestimates.

The ratio was 1.5:1 in favor of the U.S. coins but if we did it over a few months or the last year or compared it to 5 or 10 years ago, you get some very useful information, IMO.

This is the type of information we can now get in the digital age. Just like they can actually see via GPS the actual cars in a parking lot at a huge mall and compare it to the same time period 1 and 5 and 10 years ago....you now have registered users, bidders, items sold, etc...from all these websites.

Maybe an all-seeing trade group or something will start representing coin and currency collectors and aggregate all the data for the benefit of the hobbyists, collectors, dealers, auction sites, etc. That would be A-#1.

 

BTW, spectacular coins, Panzer !