What about the NGC slabbed coins that GSC sells? Do you think they would crack those open and misrepresent those as well? Or are you only warning people about their raw coins? I'm only asking because I bought a 1926 $10 Gold Indian from them last night, NGC slabbed MS-62, valued at $1150 according to my CoinManage software, I paid $795. I think I got a pretty good deal, right? This is not a "neener neener" post, I'm really looking for your honest response. Thanks for your experience and perspective.
I have purchased from them once. Two $2.5 Indians. One was good, the other had been cleaned. The photos were taken in a manner that hid the hairlines. While they did readily accept the return of the cleaned one, their dishonesty in not listing it as cleaned keeps me from returning for more. So 50/50 in my one experience with them. My advice, look elsewhere, or at least exercise extra caution with this company.
Wow! We DO agree with each other on the last part of your last sentence. I advise taking extra, if not obsessive, caution in dealing with ANYBODY on the Internet, including GSC. I thought THAT was understood. In your defense, a $2.5 Indian, both because of size and its unique style of striking, is always going to be a sketchy undertaking online. I admire your desire to wade into that. I wouldn't, not with GSC or anybody else. I reserve Indians for in-person only status.
Notice that picture is clean, clear, and crisp? You should get the slab pictured, crackouts would happen before the listing was made.
I find them to be not only beautiful myself It is very important that people who collect toned coins educate themselves to spot artificially toned coins so not to risk buying any of them. It has taken me 5 years of study but I have become pretty good at detecting AT coin. ED
Have to be careful where you're getting your values from. Nothing in any book can substitute for what things are actually selling for. A quick eBay results search shows in the last week that same graded coin has sold for: $768, $778, $770, $762, $790, $825. Of course not all coins in the same slab are equal but it gives you an idea what similar ones are going for. In my personal experience as I only buy slabbed coins online because I'm not good enough to get raw ones online...GSC's slabbed coins have ALWAYS (100% of the ones I've tracked with maybe 25 or so examples) gone for more than similarly slabbed coins. They have such a huge following it's tough to get a deal on anything they have slabbed. Just my experience but like I said a few times ITT I've never come close to buying one cause they always seem to go for way higher than I'm willing. edit: I shouldn't say they go for way more than comparable slabbed coins cause that I'm not sure of. They've always gone for way more than I've had my limit at though. I am cheap though more often than not.
We keep some good educational information here for our own reminder and to help others. The best study we have seen was done by Doug Kurz who built the Sunnywood Collection. He did a lot of defining work to help understand correct toning sequences and if you can understand them you can spot the fakes more easily. http://www.1881o.com/toned-coins.html All the coins shown on that page (and links) are PCGS certified, so we at least have one line of defense in addition to our own analysis. But not even the TPGs are perfect.
Yes, I certainly do. However, that's not exclusive to GSC, that kinda thing happens often. For what it's worth, my comments on GSC are reserved for their raw coins. As is the trend in this thread, I agree with both recent statements made by @IBetASilverDollar and @baseball21 in response to your inquiry. Now Kurt, as for your scholarly little experiment: go for it. You're not likely to convince any of us, but we certainly won't try to stop you. Our prejudices aren't unfounded and superficial, they're deep-seated after years of watching GSC antics. I stand by my original statement, their 99.8% positive feedback rating means nothing to me.
I can agree with this, raw OR slabbed. Most of the time watching or bidding on a GSC coin, one of two things happens. 1) I skulk away watching the bids go beyond my max, muttering "Great Googly Moogly" to myself, or 2) I get sniped in the last 2 seconds. Either way, it's okay with me. My max is my max. I ain't goin' higher.
That admission simply confirms exactly what I was saying. And it wasn't MY IDEA. I merely agreed with it. It was Sanderson's idea, but I get it, I'm more fun to attack. Never let a little thing like a fact get in the way of a perfectly good vendetta, right? I can't respect people who think that way (your way). There is ALWAYS more to learn. Do the world a favor. Avoid jury duty at all costs.
The reason you're not likely to convince any of us isn't because we have sacred cows and blinders on, it's because we've all seen GSC antics for numerous years. We didn't come to the conclusion that we did unfounded.
Nice try. But no matter how many times somebody tries to bring this thread "back on track", we always end up with the same guys fighting about unrelated stuff. Maybe the mods should change the thread title?
I have created a thread just for GSC and their photographs. I am not espousing a position, but perhaps one will evolve from analyzing what we can see, and what we know. I don't want to completely disregard one seller if there are coins I might enjoy owning. Everyone is free to take shots at me if you like, but my goal is to learn as much as I can. I don't have a horse in this race.
I am going to start a second thread on Toned Coins. Those of you who really enjoy name calling, retailer bashing, and destructive conversation please stay here so we can make some progress on Toned Coins. Thanks
Good luck with that. Whenever the subject of toned coins comes up there are going to be arguments and debates about it. And there should be, because it aint always what somebody says it is.
That is understandable but after a while, after the ad nauseam I know more by the parties it does get old. I'm not berating the posts I want to continuously learn not read point, counter-point. It would be nice if they could stay on the facts of the thread. That or start a new thread.
Threads tend to go where they go, nobody has any control over that. Nobody "owns" a thread, nobody can dictate what can or cannot be said (assuming the rules are followed of course). If things get too far off track then yeah a mod will step in and tell folks to get back on topic. But as long as whatever somebody says IS on topic, and within the rules, then they are allowed to say it. That's the whole point of a forum - open discussion, not closed discussion.