Why are people the way that they are.

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Restitutor, May 2, 2021.

  1. Restitutor

    Restitutor Well-Known Member

    I know I’m a young man yelling at the clouds for the hundredth time, but honestly, why do people do this? :banghead::banghead::banghead: What am I missing here?

    ACB6935D-A27F-4D43-A40D-63CCD5D7818F.jpeg FC0ED4C6-E769-4A91-8D01-CCF273151B18.jpeg 4BF2577F-F3CF-4DBA-961A-A3782F85C1EE.jpeg 0F7D3107-0F22-44C4-9C23-F6292F834A54.jpeg A67DD125-0652-49FD-9D63-4971EB24A934.jpeg 2F818B93-36D3-4EFB-9DA6-6E18502C8981.jpeg 384D20AF-541F-45C8-8B31-9BF59D0FCA6A.jpeg 68E8C124-AF76-4B24-8E98-4134F32275F8.jpeg
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  3. physics-fan3.14

    physics-fan3.14 You got any more of them.... prooflikes? Supporter

    I am not familiar with those coins, and I don't know what auction house that is - but those "estimates" are just barely above the starting points. They seem laughably low for what appears to be high quality coins. And it's not like some guy just bought it outright - that first one has 43 bids.

    The coin market has been strong and getting stronger for the past year.
  4. Silphium Addict

    Silphium Addict Supporter! Supporter

    At least two bidders thought these nice examples were worth significantly more than estimate
    philologus_1 likes this.
  5. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Supporter! Supporter

    Naumann was NUTS today. I had my heart -- if not my pocketbook -- set on this one. :(

  6. Restitutor

    Restitutor Well-Known Member

    I agree the estimates are on the lighter side, but to pay €900 for a Gordian III + 14.9% buyers fee, +1% insurance, and then DHL shipping… Wow
  7. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    The bidding at Naumann went bonkers today. If these are the future prices for ancient coins, we’re all millionaires.
    What was strange, was that there were quite a few nice coins that went for pretty moderate prices, especially many of the usually popular Dacian campaign coins of Trajan. I have given up trying to understand it. The ancient coin market is beginning to mimic the crypto market.
  8. Restitutor

    Restitutor Well-Known Member

    I like this silver lining takeaway! :hilarious: Maybe we should create some NFT Denarii as well!
  9. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    There were quite a few coins selling for around estimate too. Some nice Trajan and Lucius Verus denarii sold for prices that I considered to be fairly nice for the buyer. Had my finger close to the bidding button a few times, even though I had decided not to buy at this auction.
    +VGO.DVCKS likes this.
  10. El Cazador

    El Cazador Active Member

    Sorry to disappoint you, but you are not the only one here who likes quality stuff. I am afraid its a new normal, so gotta suck it up! “If you don’t like something- change it, if you can’t change it - suck it up and move on” - wise words from the wifie...
    Mrktstrtmyhm and +VGO.DVCKS like this.
  11. Restitutor

    Restitutor Well-Known Member

    Oh believe me when I say I’m not a jilted underbidder here. I realized a few weeks ago to not even bother watching this auction despite being an avid NN buyer. The frustration is more seeing so much dumb money being thrown at relatively common coins. High quality ancient coins are a dime a dozen, and I sincerely hope a winner didn’t think that they found a hidden gem simply because a coin is old and of fine quality.

    Here’s one of the Flavians from my OP that sold in the NN auction Mar 7 this year. In the span of like 2 months the hammer price increased by 47%. That’s absurd.

    AEB78FC3-3142-440C-AA74-9FC10BE7E954.jpeg B9FE1DD2-6CA0-41ED-B495-DF246FD65D6C.jpeg
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
  12. DonnaML

    DonnaML Supporter! Supporter

    I know that the condition of my example doesn't compare, but I paid more than $800 less for it, and am perfectly content!

    Gordian III Denarius - jpg version.jpg
  13. savitale

    savitale Well-Known Member

    Not sure about the Vespasians, but the Gordian III appears to be a very nice coin. Maybe a couple years ago these were $300 coins, but the current market is strong for excellent examples. It is a strong result, but I think the estimate was off by a factor of 10. I'm sure you will see it soon in a marketing email saying "Look! Our coins sell for 20x the estimate!"
    +VGO.DVCKS, Restitutor and DonnaML like this.
  14. Ignoramus Maximus

    Ignoramus Maximus Nomen non est omen.

    On a bright note: some coins fell through the cracks, as the saying goes.

    Unfortunately, not the coin(s) I was after. (Seleukos I for one, turns out to be an elusive emperor. I've been fruitlessly chasing an early anchor tet of him for months now...)

    I had set my alarm at just before the start of the auction, had a quick look at the pre-bids, moaned, turned around and went back to sleep (I'm working nights). So really, I earned a lot of money just by sleeping in.:happy:

    As for Seleukos the Elusive: I'll get him yet...
    svessien, +VGO.DVCKS, DonnaML and 4 others like this.
  15. ambr0zie

    ambr0zie Dacian Taraboste

    When I watch an auction, I try to estimate the hammer price of a coin, whether I am interested in it or not. If I fail badly, this means that
    a.) I don't know the true value of the coin (there were cases when I saw a coin going up in the sky and I was saying nah, it can't be, but when I searched that particular coin in previous auctions things started to make sense)
    b.) there are at least 2 collectors who want the coin and don't care too much about the price.

    Point b.) can bring bigger surprises than these examples. I can't forget that I saw this in January

    ... sold for hammer price 500 EUR.
    I am still tempted to think this is a bad joke, somebody who was just mocking the auction, as I think even 100 EUR would be too much (again, this is my personal opinion).

    I often see coins that should go for 30-40 EUR going for 100-120. Even if I am interested, I just pass, there are plenty of fish in the sea if you're not super specialized in one domain.

    I think after the Covid era (and no, I don't like this term, but it seems suitable in this case) many people have started collecting ancient coins. Personally I started this hobby "because of Covid" as my interest in ancient coins was almost zero until October 2020. Lots of free time, a PC always online, so I found "a new toy".

    Now regarding the examples in this topic, I wouldn't pay this price on a single coin. For now at least. I can't afford it and I am content with coins having not so spectacular condition. They all look excellent and probably in hand they're better.
    You can expect prices like these for coins in well above average condition (and no, I am not happy at all but this is a standard situation in numismatics, not only ancients).

    In my personal opinion, the Gordian price is a little off but I am not particularly interested in Gordian coins so my opinion is not objective.
    philologus_1, +VGO.DVCKS and DonnaML like this.
  16. Evan Saltis

    Evan Saltis College Dorm Collector Supporter

    The Gordian III is real nice. Certainly not worth that much in my view. I could get something pretty nice of the same type for many many many times less at literally any given time.

  17. Ryro

    Ryro The last of the Diadochi Supporter

    No two ways about it, that Gordian III is clearly Tobey Mcguire in some sort of Sam Ramey, Bruce Campbell produced Evil Dead 4:Deadites of the third century....

    Here's mine in near a good of shape purchased for closer to 900 pesos than euros:
    Last edited: May 2, 2021
  18. DonnaML

    DonnaML Supporter! Supporter

    I've always thought that Gordian III looked very familiar, like some actor, and I believe you may have picked the right one. Although he does have a ski nose kind of like Bob Hope's for those old enough to remember who that was.
  19. Ryro

    Ryro The last of the Diadochi Supporter

    Lol! He did have a ski nose! LOVE it!
    How about the man and @Bing ... Crosby:
    Bing, +VGO.DVCKS and DonnaML like this.
  20. Sulla80

    Sulla80 one coin at a time Supporter

    While I personally wouldn't pay 700 EUR for any Gordian III coin, I can understand why condition rarity might make it hard enough to find a perfectly centered coin with fresh dies that a couple of people looking for perfect coins could end up fighting over it : so far that hasn't prevented me from buying inferior coins at reasonable prices.

    As for the example of @Roman Collector, there must be more than one Faustina or Pamphylia specialist who felt this rare coin was worth almost 400 EUR. ("Very rare" with RPC IV.3 online 8343 2 specimens). We all look for different things in coins - for me the 400 EUR Faustina would be an uninteresting "duplicate" - but I can understand how someone else might see it very differently.
    Faustina pulvinar.jpg
    Roman Imperial, Faustina II (wife of M. Aurelius), AR Denarius, Rome, AD 147-175
    Obv: FAVSTINA AVGVSTA, diademed and draped bust right
    Rev: SAECVLI FELICIT, pulvinar, upon which are Commodus and Antoninus
    Ref: RIC 712 (Aurelius); RSC 191; BMCRE 139 (Aurelius)
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
    Spaniard, Bing, +VGO.DVCKS and 2 others like this.
  21. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Supporter! Supporter

    I wanted it because it's a provincial coin that reproduces a unique imperial design. I don't know how much it's worth -- obviously 400 euro or thereabouts to the bidders. I'm just sad it was more than I could swing.
    +VGO.DVCKS and Sulla80 like this.
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