Who hates slabs more than me?

Yup.

Why the tirade, Ben ? Don't like slabs ? Don't buy 'em.

For most high end coins, raw is unthinkable.

The reality is this : potentially valuable raw US coins are extremely picked over*. You can scream about overgraded slabs, but their batting average is a heckuva lot higher than the problem-saturated, way overgraded raw crap at shows.

Slabs have been a major boon for the hobby.



* exception : early coppers

 

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Wanna know the reason so few have been exposed to fake slabs ? There are so few of them.

Dangerous ? You betcha. Be aware ? Of course.

But are fake slabs commonplace ? I don't believe it. Maybe it depends on the environment.

 

Yes, many. Since I go to 2 to 4 coin shows a month I've gotten to know some dealers well. One dealer produced a slab he himself doctored up. It stated a Lincoln Cent and it contained a beat up dime. Others have shown me slabs that even had misspelled words. Probably from China. Fake slabs and coins from there are becoming so common our government should just give them the contract to make all our coins. They will soon enough anyway.

 

Now here is a thought. So many say or claim they have not seen a faked slab. Just how do you know? Have you had the slabs you have or seen authenticated? Did you bother to even take your slabs to another well knowledgeable dealer and ask if real? Are you an authority on plastic? Many coin collectors have purchased slabbed coins and then just put them away without any proof that they are real. The Chinese found that thier faked coins were being discovered to readily so now they are putting them in slabs. Do you know that ALL your slabs are real?
Think about that and check them all carefully.

 

Having never seen a fake slab, let's see how "common" they are. Go take my poll.

 

Yes you have, we looked at them together.

 

It does, I use plastx you can get it at any auto parts store.

 

I have to agree with just carl to a certain degree when it comes to fake slab coins i;m talking only about errors coins i want to make that clear I'm sure there are many fake errors that are being slabbed to make big bucks ,and to sell them on Xbay and fool the inexperiance novices or experianced for that matter

. I'm not being contradictive either and most slab coins are authentic. I just want to give an example of being insured by having a slab coin Say you have a raw coin that you know is a MS 69 and you bring it to a dealer to sell ,he' may say the coin is a MS67 now you know the big difference in price between the too grades right.

Now you no your coin is a MS69 and you want to get the bucks for that grade so there;s a dispute between the both of you . Now if the coin was slabbed a MS69 ,and cert ified then the dealer has to give you what the coin was graded for, no dispute. that is one plus for slabbed coins protection ,as i stated in my previous thread, and the other areas I mentioned.

I would say Carl doe's bring a good point up , but all around slab coins are the way to go.




Jazzcoins Joe

 

Presently, I appreciate slabbed coins much more than I used to. The positives completely outweigh the negatives in almost every way. Since I only buy coins already slabbed, the additional cost is small compared to the benefits.

 

Why? If I don't think the coin is a 69 I wouldn't pay 69 money for it no matter what the slab says.

I think that slabs encourage laziness and get collectors to operate out of their depth. Why learn to grade, the TPG's do that, why learn to authenticate the TPG's do that, why learn about the coin to help determine the value the slab has a number and I can look it up on the sheet. Some say that they protect newbies from making expensive mistakes until they can learn. So slabs encourage them to spend lots of money on things they don't understand and which many of them will never understand. People say that they would never feel comfortable spending large sums on raw coins, well then you don't know enough yet to be buying them. And while many say that they depend on the salbs until they can learn, a great mony just take the lazy way out and just put total dependancy on the TPG.

 

I save my hate for things that really deserve it, and for me personally, I prefer taking the grading out of the seller's hands and putting it into a third party which does, by and in large, a very good job.

 

I think there is a middle ground between your view and jazzcoins'. Of course a dealer won't pay if the coin's condition doesn't justify the grade on the slab. But it also gives the coin seller another tool to obtain fair value because it is an independent appraisal. And while it probably makes some people lazy, it also helps others learn how to grade. Maybe the lazy would have stayed lazy and the diligent would have learned anyway even without the slabs, but I don't think you can blame the slab.

 

Well I can't mention names on the forum like that GD I would say all of them not one specfic grading company.

We all know how conterfeiters can make excellent bills as well as fake errors etc etc

Why do you thing the Federal reserve has to change the bills all the time, because the conterfeiters always devise a way to duplicate the bills no matter if there are water marks in the bills.

Now if you have a great conterfiet coin that the graders are not able to detect that it;s a fake which i would think doe's happen ocassionall,OR MAKE IT PASS AS AUTHENTIC COIN TO MAKE BIG BUCKS WHO KNOWS WHAT GOES ON IN THE MARKET ( in the slab the coin goe's )

I know how great the chinese are making our coins as fakes which are getting harder to detect by the day. Just an example

PS And you asked me what makes me so sure I THINK IT HAS TO DO WITH COMMON SENSE
Jazzcoins Joe alien hybrid Zec

 

Ok, this warrents a question I've had for years now. If the professional graders acn't tell the difference with a fake that is that good, what are the chances anyone else could? And, if the fakes are as good as the real thing, quite frankly, whats the difference? They won't know, you won't know...who's going to know? Chances are excellent we've all bought knockoffs of a product, thinking they were the real thing. Chances are we never knew and were perfectly content.
Guy~

 

Yea but,if you are paying a high price for a fake that was slabbed even if you didn;t know it was a fake, ins;t that a drag., and don't you think that will make you very mad ,it sure won;t make you glad ,so you were had, and that is very bad.


Jazzcoins Joe

 

I'd be willing to bet that all my slabs are genuine , why , I look at the coin and slab to see how it conforms to the faked slabs out there , the key is education to be able to tell real from fake , plus buying from a reliable place helps too . Carl I know you're right that they are out there but if I do get burned I'll be able to return them , coins are about the only thing I save reciepts for . And hopefully through education I'll be able to stay one step in front of the counterfeiters .
rzage:thumb:

 

I think it;s getting harder to determine a fake from an authentic coin these days, because the conterfieters are becoming more creative in there craft . How do you know for sure that they didn't pass the grader because the fake was so good in spit that you may think it's real .

Jazzcoins Joe dd::goofer:

 

As someone who HAS handled counterfeit slabs... I think there is a little confusion going on here...

Have you seen the coins that they have out in the counterfeit slabs? I have only seen higher end pieces, better date pieces, early American pieces as far as US coins are concerned. There are a lot of different world coins in counterfiet holders. I have NEVER seen an US cent or a dime in a truly counterfiet holder.... I have seen holders cracked and coins replaced and then resealed... that is not a counterfiet holder... it is a cracked and replaced coin in an original holder... i have seen many of those... As for truly counterfiet slabs... they are hard to find to even study... let alone try to hose someone with it.

I go looking for people with examples and then I study them... most of the fake slabs are cheesy at best...