Where's George?

I'm not going to waste my time answering to statements from people that don't know what's going on. Look back at our conversation and maybe you would see that this $5 had 7 6's in the S/N. The BEP shredding it is what makes it history, if they didn't shred it, it wouldn't be history because it would all just be too common. BEP shredding is pro of collecting while WG stamps all over are a collectible bill IS NOT.

 

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Once again tbudwiser is right on the money. The WG propagandists don't care to listen to rhime or reason. They are out for themselves. They are out for hits, these hits that they crave are nearly the same as having an addiction to narcotics. They can't get enough hits so they stamp any and all bills they can get their hands on. They don't care if they are 1966 $100 Red Seals, $1 1977 star notes or whatever. Alot of WG users have shown sadistic tendencies as well. There have been times in the past where they have stamped old currency (even old "Mint CU" notes) and then shown not only me but others scans of them just to be taunting. These users are thugs, they are sadists. They are darn near sociopathic in how they treat collectors and get off on rubbing notes that were rare/collectible but are now ruined into peoples faces.

I love how some people use the analogy "the government made 3 billion 1988 $5 notes" and seem to use this as a justification for supporting their continued destruction. How many of these 3 billion 1988 $5 notes are still extant? How many survive today and how many will there be for future generations to enjoy? I would venture to say not many. Furthermore, some people seem to have missed the fact that the note tbudwiser was attempting to emphasize was that not only was this a Mint CU 1988 $5 note but that it had 7 sixes in the serial number as well. This makes the note even more rare than a regular old style $5 note.

 

Tbud, It was sarcasm regarding the original post, for the same reasons you mentioned, there's practically always a conversation about it on CT.

 

I love it when I get them so I can write in black sharpie over the last 2 serial numbers so it can never be tracked :devil:!

 

using Steve's numbers that means there could be potentially 7,920 notes with 7 6's. I am not Numbers so my math is probably flawed.
[TABLE="width: 77"]

06666666

60666666

66066666

66606666

66660666

66666066

66666606

66666660

8(combinations)*9(numbers other than 6)*110(runs if they were all complete with 11 billion notes)=7,920 notes with 7 - 6's


[/TABLE]
I am not going to tell you what to like or feel is important as everyone has the right to like what they like. If you are looking for an 88 - $5 with 7 6's I am pretty sure you can fine one that's available. I would never stamp one but I would like to think I can do what I want with the notes I have. I do prefer to keep them in the condition I received them in.

 

Smiley faces help with situations like these - I had to learn that the hard way.:smile

 

I'm not a WG stamper, but I have entered plenty of SNs into the WG system for the fun of hopefully getting a tracked hit someday. I think it would be fun for a WGer to get an unstamped note, enter it and find it was already in the system.

Only those pre-stamped WG notes that I have received in circulation, tracked and put back into circulation have ever returned me resultant hits. And not even all of those have come back with hits. My unstamped attempts have yet failed to return hits.

Peronally speaking, I don't collect WG notes as I am a paper money collector, maybe a 'purist' we can say, who prefers problem free, high quality notes in my collection. I occassionally strap search when I can get new straps, but I prefer those notes which have not circulated and unless brand new notes, most of what I find in strap searching doesn't meet my critieria so I don't devote so much time to this activity. I know there are some who do and that's fine, collect what you want. Another reason for my preference is the value of a high quality note to that of its circulated cousins. I seek premium quality and feel that these, uncirculated ones, are the notes that best hold a premium if/when it ever comes time to sell them. Again, this is just my approach.

Now, I'd like to propose the following...

• Any note, "damaged" by WG stamps becomes the collectible domain of the WG collectors. Purist paper money collectors shouldn't get bent out of shape over a class of "created" collectibles. There are more fish in the sea, this we know.

• Any note "damaged" by WG stamps depopulates the amount of 'un-damaged' notes thus increasing the potential value of the remaining examples prefered by paper money purists. That is, those who seek problem free, undamaged notes and assess values based on the quality of the note combined with its features and statistical data based on printages. With enormous printages of modern currency a depopulating force can only help the value increase on those un-stamped notes, be they circulated or not circulated, rarer or bearing desireable features.

 

True, they seem to have that affect for some folks, but then you also know that I don't tend to put them in my posts much either.

For what it's worth... :thumb:

 

Those are some nice finds/purchases although I'm not sure what your point is on them. I don't have any serial numbers that are that nice.

I think you forget just how scarce 7k is with paper money. 7k is next to nothing in the US collecting currency world. I'm not sure where all of the 1988 $5's went, but I do know that they are scarce. Series 1988A wasn't really printed until after 1990. Series 1988 was printed just before 1990. Series 1990 is when the added security features were added onto US currency $5's and up. When these security features were added on, the BEP started shredding all the money without the additional security features. This is where I think Series 1988 went, just like the 1995 $20's in the late '90s.

My point being, Series 1988 isn't as common as you think. I only have one out of 2 douzen old style $5's.

-tbud

 

My only point is to try to point out that they are easier to find than you think. Once you start looking, they come out of the wood-work. There are 3 88A's in this group and the numbers are about as special as they get.

 

None of those are 1988, the 3 small head $5's are all 1988A which had a higher production and as I mentioned earlier, 1988 is a whole lot scarcer than 1988A because most o the 1988's were shredded.

 

Okay, I give, when I was buying fancy numbers it got to a point I had to say enough because of how many were available if I wanted them. What that tells me is that many of the special numbers do get pulled and put into collections. Many more than I initially realized.

The real point of my original post was that there are some good people there and I don't want people reading this thread or any other to think they are all bad, because that is far from the truth. Someone reached out to me today from that site to offer me a binary at his cost. Some of these guys/gals go out of there way to pull collectible bills from circulation (and further damage) to add them to their collections or someone else that they know collect a specific set of numbers or series. Some of them are members here too and they are great members of both forums. That's it.

 

Here in Europe we have a similar system (called EuroBillTracker), and the EBT site says that, while it is not illegal to stamp the notes, they advice users to not do it. On one hand a stamp referring to the site may result in new users. On the other hand such stamped notes tend to have shorter lifetimes as they may be taken out of circulation. http://en.eurobilltracker.com/faq/?command=4096;tab=3 So I don't stamp them. My notes to hits ratio is about 200:1 ... Now if I entered €5 and €10 notes only, it would probably be better.

The WG site may be interesting, but I don't use it - seems they don't like non-US users. The "forums.wheresgeorge.com" site works fine from here, but "www.wheresgeorge.com" results in alerts such as "Error Message - This site is currently unavailable". Has been like that for years; some "furriners" are apparently allowed to enter the site while others are not. They may have excellent reasons for their policy, but it's just not worth it.

Christian

 

The admin of the site has blocked alot of overseas IP addresses due to purported security issues from foreign IPs. The issue has been highly overblown in the eyes of many and blocking bots or whatever is one thing but blocking legitimate and very real people in foreign nations is another. The decision to block IPs from so many foreign countries costs Wheres George users thousands of international hits annually. The admin of the site could take steps to allow real people in foreign lands with blocked IPs to access Wheres George to enter or hit bills. For example, the admin of the site could use a captcha system for these blocked IPs. Instead, the admin of the site chooses not to bother and just blocks access to the main Wheres George site altogether. Thousands of other websites have found ways to maintain a high level of security without impeding access to real people. The admin of the site in question refuses to budge, this is arrogance at its finest.

 

Hmm, my ISP happens to be a pretty big European one, with roughly 14 million customers. Now who is admitted by Where's George to use the WG site, and who is not, is entirely WG's business of course, and admittedly I don't really care any more. (If I enter a USD note, I usually use trackdollar.com which is a much smaller site). The only reason why I tried checking WG out this time was - and this brings us back to the topic - I wanted to see whether Where's George actually recommends about stamping notes. And in my opinion that may reduce the lifetime of a note, as banks may decide to not release them into circulation again. If you can access the site, do you know what WG's "policy" regarding such stamps is?

Christian

 

Where's George draws a fine line about stamping notes. The admin doesn't sell stamps on his site and on the main site he uses crafty lingo such as "if you choose to mark your bills..." etc. The site admin will not publicly encourage the marking of currency. This is all to avoid unwanted interest from government officials. Many believe there is nothing to worry about from the government and that the site admins fear is unwarranted. The forum is a bit more relaxed in the discussion of marking currency. The site admin will clamp down on particular members if he feels a note has been overmarked but he gives no specific definition on what actually is overmarked. It is one of those things where it is left up to the discretion of the sites users on what is considered too marked or not.

Yes, many tellers at banks put Where's George notes into their mutilation piles to be sent off and destroyed. Just because they get shipped off does not guarantee their destruction, though. The notes are first run through high-speed scanning units and are checked for fitness at various Federal Reserve Offices throughout the country. Notes that are stamped in red often make it back out without a problem as the scanning units don't "see" the color red. Notes that are stamped in black and especially blue most certainly never get reissued. It really just depends on the color and how marked up a note is.

 

Ah, thanks for the explanation! This way it makes sense to me. Had always wondered whether this is actually a big issue, as especially the low denomination notes do not have a very long "life expectancy" anyway. The part about the different colors was very interesting; did not know that ...

Christian

 

I get sealed FRB bundles of circulated currency every week. Many, many notes are stamped with black ink messages as well as red ink messages and also assorted other colors of handwritten messages. The color rejection urban legend is not backed up by any facts, just anecdotal reports, such as 'some self-check stands will reject bills marked in red and others will reject bills marked in black'.

 

OK, will ignore the part about the colors then.

Christian

 

Here is one I found