Featured Where did Herakles take Fiddyus Centus when he came to Greece? Da club of course!

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Ryro, Aug 28, 2019.

  1. Ryro

    Ryro They call me the 13th Caesar Supporter

    I've been having a blast collecting these Macedonian shield coins. Though I probably haven't taken enough time to stop and post about some of the really interesting types.
    Here is one such type that I just received in the mail today!
    It is a half unit (Fiddy Cents). Of the Macedonian shield coins we only know of half and quarter units by weight. Liampi believes there may have been full units. Though, none have come to light.
    With a unique looking helmet on the reverse, the boss (center of shield) on the obverese is so very basic, so primitive and so phallic!
    You can just hear the ancient soldiers on the March, "This is my weapon. This is my club. This one's for fighting. This one's for love."

    F7C21A10-5E0F-44C4-A267-E930B82E9599.jpeg
    Alexander III the Great
    336-323 B.C. AE half unit (15 mm, 4.45 g, 5 h). Amphipolis mint, ca. 325-310 B.C. Macedonian shield ornamented with central club / B-A, Macedonian helmet. Price 419. Near VF, green patina.

    The club:
    B600AD6A-EC7A-449C-A384-FAE94AFE0FBD.jpeg

    A quick Wikipedia definition reminds us: "A club (also known as a cudgel, baton, bludgeon, truncheon, cosh, or nightstick) is among the simplest of all weapons: a short staff or stick, usually made of wood, wielded as a weapon since prehistoric times."

    Clubs are so ancient even the earliest Egyptians had to get in on the fun!
    Here is the Narmer pallet (somebody I knows most recent Avatar). It dates to about the 31st century BCE. And shows, what is in all probability the first King of both upper and lower Egypt, Narmer unifying the 2 and smiting his enemy with a mace/club!

    0710E561-2197-49B4-BEF9-75711A75E4CE.jpeg

    Man's first weapon aside for the closed first. Could there be a more perfect weapon for Greece's most macho tough guy?!?

    1CD1E442-87E9-4941-9B8A-8B1CF6BE81E3.png
    Alexander III the Great
    336-323 B.C. AE 20 (19.5 mm, 5.74 g). Uncertain mint in Western Asia Minor, ca. 323-310 B.C. Head of Alexander the Great as Hercules right, wearing the lion-skin headdress / ΒΑΣΙΛΕΩΣ, bow in bow-case above and club, the weapons of Hercules; torch in field below.

    Thanks for reading my post. I was lucky enough to find my new (slightly used) Macedonian shield coin with a burley club laden boss and thought I better show it off. Here are some others!

    950221D8-C3E5-4C52-B85A-9A25ACD461DE.png
    Alexander III 'the Great'
    (336-323 BC). AE (18mm, 5.70g). Uncertain mint in Macedon. Head of Herakles right, wearing lion skin / AΛEΞANΔPOY. Club, quiver and bow. Price 266. Former Kairos Numismatik

    17A31505-1EF2-4DB2-A2C8-A94958C81CEF.jpeg
    Antiochos VII Euergetes(Sidetes).
    138-129 BC. Æ (17mm, 6.35 g, 3h). Contemporary imitation. Uncertain mint, imitating Antioch. Lion's head right / Vertical club downward. SC 2073 (this coin referenced and illustrated); HGC 9, 1097. very fine

    227A390D-0DB0-4586-B9A8-8B3364A2E2F5.png
    Time of Philip V and Perseus. 187-168 BC. AR Tetrobol (14mm, 2.45 g, 3h). Pella or Amphipolis mint. Zoilos, magistrate. Struck circa 184-179 BC. Macedonian shield with club on boss / Macedonian helmet; two monograms to left, monogram and tripod to right. SNG Ashmolean 3279
    Ex: inAsta

    E1A1F6D8-4F8C-46D8-AED9-AC6444AC87D9.jpeg
    Commodus
    177-192 AD AE As 24-25 mm, 10.34 g, Rome, 192 AD.
    Obv. L AEL AVREL COMM AVG P FEL, Head to right, wearing lion skin headdress.
    Rev. HERCVL / ROMAN / AVGV / S C, Legend divided by club within laurel wreath.
    RIC III 644; C. 193; BMC 722.
    An interesting type. Fine to very fine.From: Auctiones GmbH




    Now go ahead and please post your clubs, Macedonian Shields, Herakles or whatever puts the bub in da club...
     
    Last edited: Aug 28, 2019
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  3. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    Nice write up on the many variations of "da club," Ryro. Nice examples too.

    How about a club countermark? I got this AE from Pergamum some time ago, but I have not been able to find a reference to the countermark anywhere. Any guidance on this would be greatly appreciated.

    CM Mysia Pergamon club countermark Feb 18 (0).jpg

    Pergamum, Mysia Æ 19
    (c. 200-27 B.C.)

    Helmeted head of Athena right / AΘHNA[Σ] [N]IKHΦOΡO[Y] to left & right of trophy of arms. O on ΔI monogram in left field.
    Weber 5198; BMC 179.
    Countermark: Club of Hercules (?) reverse. Unattributed.
    (4.87 grams / 17 x 19 mm)
     
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  4. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Supporter! Supporter

    Here's a Herculean club on a tiny provincial assarion.

    [​IMG]
    Septimius Severus, AD 193-211.
    Roman provincial Æ assarion, 16.0 mm, 2.51 g, 12 h.
    Moesia Inferior, Nicopolis ad Istrum.
    Obv: ΑV Λ CΕVΗΡΟC, laureate head right.
    Rev: ΝΙΚΟΠΟΛΙ ΠΡΟC ΙC, club.
    Refs: AMNG I 1425; Moushmov 970.
     
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  5. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana Supporter

    Good stuff, @Ryro. Can I join the 'club' with a lagobolon? It was the ancient Greek hunter's preferred choice of club for bashing rabbits. :D

    Illyria Apollonia Half Victoriatus b.jpg ILLYRIA, Apollonia
    AR Hemidrachm (Half-Victoriatus). 1.5g, 14.8mm. ILLYRIA, Apollonia, circa mid-late 1st century BC. Maier 121; BMC 44. O: AI-NEA, fires of the Nymphaeum of Apollonia. R: AΠOΛΛΩ-NIATAN, lagobolon (rabbit-bashing stick).

    If that one doesn't cut it, I have a standard-issue club from Sparta.

    Lakonia Lacedaemon.jpg
    LAKONIA, Lakedaimon (Sparta)
    AE20. 5.7g, 20.3mm. LAKONIA, Lakedaimon (Sparta), C. Julius Eurycles as hegemon, circa 21 BC. HGC 5, 625; RPC 1103; BCD Peloponnesos 921; SNG Cop 603. O: Head of Zeus right. R: Club; Λ-A/EΠI EY/PY-K(ΛE)/O-Σ in four lines across field; all within wreath.
    Ex BCD Collection; ex Joseph J. Copeland Collection
     
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  6. ominus1

    ominus1 Supporter! Supporter

    headko.jpg Alexander coins 001.JPG Alexander coins 003.JPG ..i'd just show the clubbed one..but i hate to break up a set:rolleyes:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 29, 2019
  7. Ryro

    Ryro They call me the 13th Caesar Supporter

    WoWiE! Some cool clubs so far.
    @Marsyas Mike amazing coin. Never seen that type of CM. I could help id it better if it were in hand...and mine;)
    Nice one @Roman Collector! A BIG club on a little coin. Like a fat man walking a tiny dog it makes you look twice.:pompous:
    Haha! @zumbly! I see what you did there. Certainly, you are in the club "club" with that saweet lagobolon!
    As I recall that is the favorite whomping stick of a certain satyr...
    2355035E-67A7-46BB-99B1-3FF059AC0ABA.png
    Antigonus II. Gonatas (277 - 239 BC). Bronze.
    Vs: Head of the Athena with Corinthian helmet on the right.
    Rs: BA. Pan right a trophy building; in the field left, in the field right Lagobolon, between the legs monogram.
    SNG Copenhagen 1205. SNG Alpha Bank 1020.

    Excellent album title and coins @ominus1! Funny enough Foreigner is coming to town next month!
     
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  8. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    Nice write-up Mr. @Ryro ! GREAT lookin' Alex III Club coin!!!

    Hmmm...
    Hmmm.... I have skads of each of these... But, I will join the CLUB:

    The VARIETY CLUB:

    APULIA
    Got this one through @Severus Alexander , just to have the Denom...
    upload_2019-8-29_7-54-57.png
    APULIA Luceria 211-200 BCE AE Quadrunx 9.7g 24mm Hd Herakles R lion skin headdress 4 pellets behind - LOVCERI Quiver club bow SNG Cop 660


    TROAS
    upload_2019-8-29_7-56-35.png
    Troas Birytis 350-300 BCE Æ 9mm1.21g Hd Kabeiros L pileos - two stars above Club within wreath SNG Cop 249 Left


    ROMAN PRE-REFORM AE
    upload_2019-8-29_7-57-47.png
    Roman Republic AE Double Litra 235 BCE 19.5mm 6.54g Rome mint Hercules r club - Pegasus r club ROMA Cr 27-3 HN Italy 316 S 591


    THRACE
    upload_2019-8-29_7-59-40.png
    Thrace Thasos 146-50 BCE Roman provincial or Military mint AR Tet Dionysos Herakles Club Lion skin


    ETRURIA
    Etruria or Umbria Aes Grave 3rd C BCE Sextans 23mm 25.15g Club-2 Dots HN 54 Vecchi-Th 172.JPG
    Etruria Aes Grave 3rd C BCE Sextans 23mm 25.15g Club-2 Dots HN 54 Vecchi-Th 172


    ROMAN IMPERIAL
    Gallienus Silvered Æ Ant CE 263-264 AVG rad cuiras R  Hercules R lion skin club star RIC 673.jpg
    Roman Imperial Gallienus Silvered Æ Ant CE 263-264 AVG rad cuiras R Hercules R lion skin club star RIC 673


    MAKEDON
    upload_2019-8-29_8-4-7.png
    Makedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AE 17 Struck ca 325-310 BCE Herakles hd r wearing lion skin - Bow in bow case and club branch


    ROMAN SILVER
    upload_2019-8-29_8-6-5.png
    RR C POBLICIUS Q f 80 BCE AR Denarius serratus 3.94g Rome Flan wgt control gouge (Stannard Scoop) Hercules strnglng Nemean lion club quiver Cr 380-1 Syd 768


    MACEDONIA PROVINCE
    upload_2019-8-29_8-9-19.png
    RR Macedon occupation Alexander - Club Coin chest Quaestor Chair wreath Aesillas Quaestor AR Tet Thessalonika Mint BC 90-70


    BABYLON
    upload_2019-8-29_8-11-1.png
    Babylon Makedon Alexander III 336-323 BC AR Obol 7mm 0.51g Lifetime Herakles lion skin Club bow quiver wreath M Price 3744
     
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  9. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    Now, THAT is cool!
     
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  10. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    LOL, @zumbly inspired the song! You Goon! :)

     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
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  11. Ryro

    Ryro They call me the 13th Caesar Supporter

    Man O' man. Where else, other then coin talk, can you find 50 cent and little bunny foo foo hanging out in the same thread in harmony???
    Amazing stuff @Alegandron! That Eutrurian Aes graves, among some amazing club coins, screams "best in club"... Or at least most primitive!
    Though, it reminded me that I had left out another recently purchased Macedonian shield coin with a bad @$$ club that may be my favorite club:
    A22D164E-A9CF-4F8E-9887-F28B61DBADE4.jpeg
    I'll plagiarise myself from the, Follow the coin, thread, "In Liampi's 1986 study, probably the most comprehensive on this coinage to date, she says,
    "Of particular interest is the type, which is found in a numerically small imprint, with omphalos as a shield boss (midfield) (nos. 160 ff.). The reverse image (Gorytos, Club, ear of grain, K) is identical with the reverse images of those imprints which depict the Herakles head on the obverse (Nos. 134 ff.). Parallel to this type of averaging exists another variant of the reverse, which retains the characteristic of this series helmet with the letter K and the ear as an example."
    I believe this is an reference to the fact that this type very well may have been during Alexander's lifetime, despite missing the BA."
    Alexander III 'the Great'
    336-323 BC Ae. Uncertain mint in Asia Minor.Obv: Macedonian shield w/ omphalos boss. Rev: K. Bow in bow-case, club and grain ear.Price -; Liampi M 11; AMNG I 207-8 (Kallatis).
    Diameter: 15mm
    Weight: 2.16gr
    Condition: Very Fine
    Provenance: From a Private UK Collection. Ex: Ares numismatics
     
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  12. Alegandron

    Alegandron "ΤΩΙ ΚΡΑΤΙΣΤΩΙ..." ΜΕΓΑΣ ΑΛΕΞΑΝΔΡΟΣ, June 323 BCE Supporter

    LOL, I read that and bust out laughing!
     
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  13. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member Supporter

    My favorite club stands atop a lion skin pile of this as of Trajan. At first glance, I thought it was a Trajan's Column reverse but one quick blink told me to look again.
    rc1745fd1302.jpg
     
  14. Curtisimo

    Curtisimo the Great(ish) Supporter

    Anytime we see Hercules we are bound to see his club as well. In fact, it would be more interesting to see a full body depiction of Hercules WITHOUT the club on a coin!
    8C606ECF-1794-41BB-BAE2-AA47ED974526.jpeg
    965E2321-B832-429F-914D-284E82BE9C8E.jpeg
    93ED6FDE-9224-4FD6-8388-F66F5D92D60A.jpeg
    Here is what is probably my favorite club on a coin from my collection.
    690ABB57-E47F-4BA2-8DE8-2D3B7AC33743.jpeg
    And here is a club that does not seem to be related to Hercules (at least overtly).
    2112F688-1AC6-424F-8010-F9F7D3958E35.jpeg
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2019
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  15. Sulla80

    Sulla80 one coin at a time Supporter

    @Ryro, great club & shields theme! Your (almost) favorite Macedonian shield coin and the Alexander III in the OP are particularly nice. As entrance fees to "da club", here's an RR/imperatorial - Sicinius having fled with Pompey to the East after Caesar crossed the Rubicon in January of BC 49, struck money in exile (Asia minor?). The "S.C." an attempt to claim legitimacy.
    Coponius denarius Blk.jpg
    Q. Sicinius moneyer and C. Coponius praetor, 49 BC, AR denarius
    Obv: Q. SICINIVS, diademed head right of Apollo III VIR
    Rev: C. COPONIVS - PR. S. C., Club upright, on which hangs lion's skin with head in profile; arrow left; bow to right
    Ref: Sear 413; Sicinia 1; Cr. 444/1a


    and a favorite shield & club coin
    Macedonia Tetra.jpg Macedon, under Roman Rule, circa 167-70 BC, AR Tetradrachm
    Obv: Diademed bust of Artemis right, quiver over shoulder, in the center of an ornate Macedonian shield
    Rev: Club; monogram above, two monograms below, all within oak wreath; thunderbolt to left
    Ref: AMNG III 177; SNG Copenhagen 1315; SNG Ashmolean 3299.
     
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  16. Limes

    Limes Supporter! Supporter

    Interesting coins, not the ones i collect. But its nice to see the club in various cultures and their coins.
    @Curtisimo, your coin of Commodus is amazing! I dont see many specimens that are well struck like yours. The are popular too, prices in auctions are at times quite high.

    Here is my poor quality one. I still like it a lot, but im always on the look out for a better one, or other type.


    35.2 no tekst.png
     
  17. Shea19

    Shea19 Supporter! Supporter

    Just won this one yesterday at the Leu auction...very happy to be able to join the “club”.

    IMG_6655 (1).jpg
    KINGS OF BITHYNIA. Prusias II Cynegos, 182-149 BC. Dichalkon (Bronze, 18 mm, 4.28 g, 1 h). Head of Prusias II to right, wearing winged diadem. Rev. ΒΑΣΙΛΕΩΣ - ΠΡΟYΣΙΟΥ Herakles standing front, head to left, holding club set on ground in his right hand and lion skin in his left; to lower right, monogram. RG p. 225, 25.
     
  18. Ryro

    Ryro They call me the 13th Caesar Supporter

    A type I already have with a rough obverese, but that club just looks so beefy and skull crackingly bad @$$ I kinda had to get it.
    New guy then old one:
    D50B94A9-6D43-40E4-A9E0-1262A7D004E4.jpeg 9F1758A2-CD64-47D0-A9AE-7A9A911E0D26.jpeg
     
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