I every now and then read about nice coins $1,000+ range that people buy for more than the PCGS/NCG stated value. Its my expericen that coins usually sell for 30% below or atleast near the predetermined value. When is a dealer justified in asking more and when is it reasionable to pay more? For example I'm looking at an 1900 Half dollar graded PR 64 by PCGS (CERT #28067927). The PCGS value is 1,700 and the Nusmedia Fmv is 1,810. The dealer is firm at asking 2,100. Most of his other coins are below listed value and closer to FMV.
My feeling is that a dealer is justified in asking more whenever he or she feels the market will bear that sum... We all pay a bit more or less than market depending on just how badly we desire a certain coin---I've paid a bit more (though not in excess of $1,000 ) for a coin I had to have while growing frustrated at losing it at a lower price--though still high---at auction. Of course, the market rules, and that dealer may reluctantly release that coin you mention if it sits on his shelf indefinitely with no takers.... Just how badly do you want it??
There are no predetermined values. All depend on supply and demand, and location can be far more important than any book value. All catalogue values are rough guides. The only way they change is by people generally paying more or less than the alleged 'book value'. A single rich new collector can skew values upwards, a coin or type falling out of favour can see that type being cheaper year on year, and the general state of the economy can mean all prices shrink with disposable incomes or inflate with monetary inflation or higher real incomes. To allot precise values to any coin is to live in a dream, imagining certainty in a world of shifting values that you can never be fully abreast of. Books of prices pander to an illusion and need to be taken with a big pinch of salt.
I totally agree with afantiques... All values, however calculated, are mere ball-park figures reflecting current and past trends and ---like all market driven commodities--may or may not reflect future values or demand or what someone may be willing to pay.
I'm not sure which question to reply to so I'll try both. When more then graded value? Well I'm not sure what "graded Value" is to you as all values are kind of up in the air. I think the real value is what the seller and buyer come to an agreement with in a non coerced environment. Now if your talking PCGS, NGC, Red Book, Coin Mags, CDN, Ebay then several options such as toning, under graded coin, pedigree, sentimental value, access to comparable ones, timing, who graded it...ect... or When is a dealer justified in asking more? When ever he wants. He can ask what he wants for any reason. It's his coin. How could any of us tell you what to ask for your used car when you want to sell it. But to the point I don't know why you would ask this in the first place. A dealer asks what he wants for whatever reason. The only question you should be asking in my opinion is do I want the coin for that price?
He is dreaming...dealer's greysheet bid is $1400 and ask is $1525. I would love to buy a PR64 Barber half at a reasonable price, but not for $700 over bid..
It seems there are two reasons why a coin sells for more than it is worth. There are buyers at the price especially if there are more buyers than amount of coins available or the seller is hoping to take advantage of someone's lack of knowledge.
If the coin is not dipped, and has nice natural toning, I will sometimes pay a premium for it. As a rule, I don't even collect dipped coins anyway. Sorry to say but a bright shiny 19th century coin doesn't do anything for me, because of course it's been dipped, whereby a nice natural toned coin to me is the definition of coin beauty. I don't even mind a spot or two on the coin if it's off towards the edges. But of course to each his own, I realize some like bright shiny vintage coins, it's just not for me. The main thing is to COLLECT.
The question asked is - When is a coin worth more than graded value? The answer is - when it is worth more. Now some are probably sitting there reading that and saying - what ??? But that really is the answer. How can that be so ? It's pretty simple, it's because no 2 coins even graded the same by the same grading company are equal. It seems that a lot of folks have the idea that a grade means the given coin is worth $X. But that simply isn't so because the coins are not the same even though they are graded the same. Here's an example. These are the 4 most recent results, in order, for the coin in question sold on Heritage. These all sold between 6 months and less than 2 years ago. And they were all within $250, or less, of each other. Now who would say that those 4 coins are all equal to one another ? I certainly wouldn't. And if they aren't equal to one another then how can they all be worth the same amount of money ? Answer, they can't be. Now what about this coin ? This coin sold for roughly double what any of the 4 above sold for, and it did it 12 years ago before the coin market saw any significant appreciation in values. What do you think it'd sell for today ? And yes that is a PCGS slab. So ask yourself, is that coin worth more ? It's the same grade, same company, same sales venue. Now some are going to say yeah but that coin if graded today would be significantly upgraded - I'd have to say I agree with you. And I'm pretty sure you all know why. But let's forget about that, just throw it out, one of those 4 coins above was graded in the '90s after all. So on that basis it would be upgraded too. But what if that coin from 2003 were in a recent slab and graded the same - would it not still be worth more ? And that's the answer to when is a coin worth more than graded value - it's worth more when it is a nicer coin than the others graded the same. Coins of the same grade are not equal.
Sometimes, you have to throw away the price guide. This coin books for a whole $8 according to Numismedia FMV. I paid more than double what the highest auction price I could find in the past 3 years (which was more than 4 times the book value), and I think it was worth it. The answer is that you pay more than the book says when you feel it's worth more. Nothing more, nothing less.
