What's Better: Undergraded OGH/CAC or Higher-Graded Modern Holder ?

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by GoldFinger1969, Feb 7, 2021.

  1. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    And by better, I really mean....which do YOU prefer ?

    Because if you were almost certain that "cracking it out" would lead to a 1 and MAYBE even 2 grade improvement, would you keep a nice coin in an Old Green Holder (OGH) or similar, older holder associated with "conservative grading"...plus you have the CAC sticker as well....or would you go for a new holder and a 1 and maybe 2 grade bump ?

    Now....I'm not saying that you're getting a more valuable coin !! Because I assume that astute collectors will see the niceness of the coin ("buy the coin, not the slab") and see the OGH and the CAC and realize it's not like a similarly-graded coin in a slab from 10 years later without CAC. It's clearly undergraded.

    Which would you prefer ? Would you crack-out ?
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2021
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  3. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    For me....well, I've never submitted so I'm projecting....unless I KNEW I would be losing money when I sold the coin, I'd probably keep it in the OGH/CAC and only do a crack-out when I needed to unload it.

    I like the classic older holders and labels.

    And if I could close most of the "gap" that would happen if I were to crack-out, I'd probably keep it in the OGH if I could get 80% of the difference. In other words, if I paid $5,000 and I know if I crack-out it's worth $10,000 and you tell me I can still sell it without doing the crack-out and get $9,000 or a bit above, that's probably OK with me. I can leave a few hundred bucks on the table.

    OTOH....if we're talking a boost of tens of thousands of dollars and leaving thousands of dollars (or more) on the table....then no. :D
  4. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    Depends on the value between grades. In general though if it had the Gold CAC I would keep it as is, if no gold then most likely crack it out if the value is there. The new holders are so much better than the old ones.
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  5. Robert Ransom

    Robert Ransom Well-Known Member

    I'm from the old school. "Leave well enough alone" which I think is an odd phrase, but hey...
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  6. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    What do you mean -- you mean protection-wise or ability to clearly see the coin ?
  7. okbustchaser

    okbustchaser I may be old but I still appreciate a pretty bust Supporter

    I'm not Baseball, but the answer is both. The older holders don't come close to measuring up to the newest ones.
  8. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    It all depends on the coin, it's grade and the price difference. Having that CAC is nice.
    GoldFinger1969 likes this.
  9. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    I have an OGH from about 1995-98 time period, I'm going to check it closely against a more modern one. I really didn't notice any inability to clearly see the coin, to be honest with you.

    Now, whether the plastic is as protective against the air or other elements, that I couldn't tell you. But I believe it has the 4-prongs to make seeing the sides easier and not like that all-white NGC holder that 100% encases the coin.
  10. ToughCOINS

    ToughCOINS Dealer Member Moderator

    Despite their claims of consistency, the grading services will always fluctuate in their output, not because of changing standards, but because of "drift". Just like measuring instruments, re-calibration to a standard is periodically required to keep drift to a minimum, and the graders are no different. Bad luck might have you crack this coin, and submit it next week, only to eventually learn that grading done over the next year is regarded by the market as being too loose.

    It's the coin that determines its value, not the holder, so I wouldn't crack the old holder if you feel you can get the premium for the coin as-is.

    Finally, I'm generalizing here, but truly knowledgeable buyers are more likely to pay all of the premium a nice coin is really worth, whereas less knowledgeable buyers who are more dependent upon holders know the market less well, and are less likely to pay all of the money for a coin that nice.
  11. Long Beard

    Long Beard Well-Known Member

    I'm currently debating that same dilemma with one listed at Heritage. Value-wise, which I'm not looking at it from a profit point, one grade higher verses the premium some pay for the old holder isn't there. I am one of those "buy the coin" collectors. Being graded as genuine is why I buy them encapsulated. When I look at the magnified images of the MS64 it looks spot on to the 1911 in MS65 that I have. So for me, a matching coin grade makes sense. Yes, I could simply buy one in the grade as the 1905 is common date, but if it could be bought for less why not roll the dice?
  12. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    I don't think I've ever seen an OGH+CAC. Probably because most CAC quality coins in OGHs have already been cracked out and resubmitted.

    Personally, I would keep it just as is. Eventually, there won't be any CAC-quality coins left in OGHs. I think that adds value in it's own right...for no other reason than under-graded coins in OGHs is a link to our shared experience. Over time, I believe the Collector Base for your coin/slab will increase as Availability declines.

    Yakpoo's Value Equation: Value = Collector Base / Availability

    You can always crack it out later if you change your mind (measure twice, cut once).
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2021
  13. baseball21

    baseball21 Well-Known Member

    The plastic is clearer now. This is especially true talking about the new PCGS holders with are also water proof to an extent and scratch resistant. NGC has a scratch resistant option but it isn't their standard holder, though it would be the standard holder for mid four figure coins like the one in your example as it comes with the express tier and higher.
  14. Jaelus

    Jaelus The Hungarian Antiquarian Supporter

    If I'm buying it, I'd rather it be the OGH+CAC, but to keep in my collection, I would crack it out and resubmit.
  15. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    the coin speaks for itself. it always will.
    the coffin...scratched, "leaky", less than biolab4 protection, etc., i understand.
    if that is the concern, there are preservation quality bags.

    as to value, it is what the buyer and seller agree to.

    in the market of today, the ogh can hurt or help, depending...again... on the coin.

    while the cac approval is helpful, there have still been bloopers.

    bidders offering to buy an unseen in hand coin will more than likely pay more for an ogh with cac, because it has over the years become one of those coin myths without substantial proof of infallibility.

    buy the coin not the coffin.
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  16. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    It was either for a Liberty or a Saint, I came across it while doing research on auctions going back 20 years. Whether it's still in that OGH I have no idea.
    By "you" I trust you mean our audience here as I was just musing hypothetically :D...I actually do NOT possess such a coin or holder at this time. In fact, I think I only have 1 or 2 CACs now that I think about it. Both on Morgans, I think.
  17. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    Oh...ok (duh!) :oops:

    Lol, if you ever get one, my advice stands. :D
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  18. yakpoo

    yakpoo Member

    Last edited: Feb 7, 2021
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  19. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

  20. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

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  21. GoldFinger1969

    GoldFinger1969 Supporter! Supporter

    Yup, and also on HA who tend to be a smarter buyer than those on Ebay.

    But in general....since no 2 coins are exactly alike...it's always tough to determine the FMV "solo" and then ascribe the extra $$$ to the holder, CAC, toning, etc.
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