What quality control?

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Roman Collector, Mar 4, 2018.

  1. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    These coins of Gallienus demonstrate some of the worst lapses in quality control at the mint. This isn't post-mint damage or the effects of corrosion. These coins looked awful immediately after striking.

    Post your coins that illustrate shoddy workmanship at the mint!

    Gallienus PAX flan chip.jpg
    Gallienus PAX off center.jpg
     
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  3. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper

    Talk about a flan that's way too small for the die.

    claud_iovi_6.jpg
    Claudius II Gothicus, AD 268-270.
    Æ Antoninianus, 17mm, 3.3g, 12h; Rome mint.
    Obv.: IMP C CLAVDIVS AVG; Radiate and draped bust right.
    Obv.: IOVI VICTORI; Jupiter standing left, holding thunderbolt and scepter.
    Reference: RIC Va 54, p. 215
    Ex: YOC Collection
     
  4. Mike Margolis

    Mike Margolis Well-Known Member

    terribly off flan but fine Greek silver and 100% real. cherorealobv.jpg cheroreal2.jpg
     
  5. TJC

    TJC Well-Known Member

    Some of the best 'worst 3rd century coins' were struck during the reign of Gallienus.

    Here is high grade (I would call it EF) Gallienus with a weak strike and pitted surfaces. The surfaces show very little actual wear. The micro porosity intermittent around the coin reveals the thinness of the original silvering layer. This thin silver layer is intact in the bottom of large pits on Gallienus's cheek and neck area. These pits were present when the coin was struck. Likely the result of a planchet flaws or being struck through debris. I am in the struck through debris camp on most of the pitting.
    GallienusHerkulesAppleO1x335.jpg GallienusHerkulesAppleR1x335_edited-1.jpg
     
  6. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    i have one of those too..an unlucky strike on the obverse on a few of those Chersonesus half drachms..but yeah, Gallienus's coins reek of what seems like plain non qualified celators..it just not one or two, but all.. the very best of his coins look crappy to me. thracian chersonesus hemidrachm 003.JPG thracian chersonesus hemidrachm 006.JPG herennius etruscus 004.JPG herennius etruscus 006.JPG
     
  7. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES!

    We're going to have to get rid of Kevin in flan quality control.

    Capture.JPG


    102_7370_zps1qaiyo98.jpg
     
  8. Ancient Aussie

    Ancient Aussie Well-Known Member

    Silver far to soft when struck, and believe it or not common for this type. 560_large_4c29983d26c06c4cbc8c12a42a771dc9.jpg
     
  9. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Wow, @Roman Collector, those are some wonderful examples of what the mint workers were (in)capable of at the time. I love em!

    2A42FD54-04FD-4450-A47B-DD31E5A4712F.jpeg
    F4A48525-7E3F-458C-AD43-CD0DAD1A0667.jpeg
    8CEF47E4-C6F4-4A04-B919-D31C28A7EDEA.jpeg
    788C0374-2FAC-48B0-A009-6486FA2E1643.jpeg
     
  10. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    This problem bothered Aurelian to the point that he forced the Roman mint into doing their job with a little more care. His earliest coins look like those of his immediate predecessors. Following the revolt of mint workers under Felicissimus. it is amazing what can be accomplished with a little guidance and, perhaps, a few executions.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Felicissimus
    rs2210bb1955.jpg rs2220bb0427.jpg rs2330bb1413.jpg
     
  11. David Atherton

    David Atherton Flavian Fanatic

    An atypically bad specimen from Antioch. Oblong flan, off-centre, and double struck. What more could you ask for?

    V1561.jpg
    Titus as Caesar
    AR Denarius, 2.98g
    Antioch Mint, 72-73 AD
    RIC V1561 (C). BMC V516. RSC 122. RPC 1933 ( 14 spec.).
    Obv: T CAES IMP VESP PON TR POT; Bust of Titus, laureate, draped, bearded, r.
    Rev: NEP RED; Neptune stg. l., foot on globe, with acrostolium and sceptre
    Ex Harry N. Sneh Collection.
     
  12. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    Kindom of Paeonia, Patraos, Silver Tetradrachm

    Obv:– Laureate head of Apollo right with short hair right.
    Rev:– PATRAOU, armed warrior on horse prancing right, spearing fallen enemy who holds spear and shield, EM monogram in left field
    Minted in Kindom of Paeonia, Patraos from . B.C. 335 - 315.
    Ref:– SNG Oxford 3359 (different dies)
    12.646g, 27.5mm, 90 degrees

    Obverse struck off centre, so much so that the die alignment mark (bottom of obverse) has come into view.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. gsimonel

    gsimonel Well-Known Member

    To save space, I'll avoid the 3rd century and the Romano-Gallic Empire.
    Has anyone ever gotten a full obverse portrait on one of these?
    Athens.JPG
    These also come in very weird shapes:
    Thasos.JPG
    Moving forward into to Rome:
    Septimius_Severus16.jpg
    and into the 4th century, where it gets easier to find slipshod workmanship,
    Constans4.jpg
    to the point where it becomes difficult to avoid it:
    Flavius_Victor2.jpg
     
  14. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    That's interesting about Felicissimus. This is one of the most educational sites about ancient history on the web.
     
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  15. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    My Athena is close but not quite (lost most of the plume and the very tip of her nose.)
    [​IMG]

    I got close to a good one from Thasos....

    [​IMG]

    My Rom example of your type is better but still pretty bad
    [​IMG]
     
  16. Deacon Ray

    Deacon Ray Artist & Historian Supporter

    Last edited: Mar 5, 2018
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  17. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper

    Kevin in flan quality control strikes again...

    tet ii implements 6 (1).jpg

    The coins of Tetricus I and Tetricus were a low point in Roman numismatics history, not to be repeated or exceeded until the last 4 decades of the Western Roman Empire.
     
  18. maridvnvm

    maridvnvm Well-Known Member

    How about off-centre and uneven strike. Probably saw the flan was off-centre and then adjusted the swing and blam you get this....

    This image helps you see the reverse being very off centre

    [​IMG]

    This image helps you see the uneven nature of the strike. The flan is still full thickness on the left and more and more thin across the coin. This stretched out the flan too....

    This does mean that some of the detail on the Pegasus is still there but this coin is in such a state that it would put lots of people off. I like it because it shows hints of part of the process of making these.

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Marsyas Mike

    Marsyas Mike Well-Known Member

    The great thing about poor quality control is that I can generally afford their botched efforts, thousands of years later. Workers for Roman Republican moneyers L. Valerius Flaccus, D. Junius L. f. Silanus, and Meniskos in Dyrrhachium were all having a bad day here:

    RR Illyria off-center Mar 18 (2).JPG
    RR Illyria off-center Mar 18 (5).JPG
     
  20. kevin McGonigal

    kevin McGonigal Well-Known Member

    A testament to the Persians at the gates in the East, the Germans on the Rhine-Danube, and a free for all of usurpers just about everywhere within the empire.
     
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  21. Nyatii

    Nyatii I like running w/scissors. Makes me feel dangerous

    Hard to concentrate on centering the flan with someone poking you in the back with a sword.
     
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