What Are Your Thoughts on Graded Ancient Coins?

I would like to see what the various members here think about the subject of having your ancients graded. Do you like your ancients slabbed or do you like to touch them? Does having them slabbed add to your enjoyment of this hobby? Do you think your heirs would fare better if the coins are slabbed?

 

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A quality ancient coin will always fetch quality cash when up for sale.

However, liquidity would be better with an NGC graded ancient, theoretically.

I do like to hold them, and slabs can be spacey once you get a few.

I, however, do not have any ancients worth more than 400 dollars or so. Not an expert

 

I dislike slabs and I have no use for somebody else's grading.

 

Some folks like slabs and some do not. I bought two coins in slabs. One deserved to be in a slab. The other did not. I have not removed them. A slab does not increase the chance I will buy a coin.

 

I'm certainly no expert, I have maybe a dozen ancients. That said, I have quite a few circulated bust halves that I buy raw because I do like to touch them. And I do feel like I can get a large part of my money back out of them if I do choose to sell. And a lot of my better US/world coins are slabbed.

Buying unslabbed ancients feels a bit different to me. Seems like a game(?) where you just can't worry much at all about precision pricing, resale, etc. Just enjoying the hunt, the history, etc. Sounds cool to me but I hesitate to spend too much in this area. I do kinda consider my collection an asset or savings account.

Shoot me down, that's fine.

 

Slabs work better with modern issues particularly proof coins as they prevent 'damage'. With ancients, each coin is unique and a buyer has to decide what he/she likes about a specific coin, the slab will only indicate the usage (wear and tear, surface condition, style etc.).

But a lot depends on personal likes and preferences when it comes to ancients. Most ancients are circulated and perhaps another scratch or ding doesn't matter. But what about a soft metal coin, say an Otho mint state aureus? Worth many tens of thousands or even six figures, would you risk scratching or damaging it just because you wanted to hold it or feel it?

I don't own one but if I did, I'd definitely want to preserve it for posterity or if I decided to sell it some time in the future. A slabbed coin will get a higher price at an auction than a comparable raw coin every day of the week. Plus its not something I would feel the need to play with or touch on a regular basis. So yeah I'd slab it and keep it that way. What if one accidentally dropped it on a hard surface and gave it an edge knock??

Same reason I don't open my iPhone every day (or EVER) to admire its technology.

 

There is a fairly large number of threads and posts on this site regarding the grading (and slabbing) of ancient coins -- most notably this recent one:

https://www.cointalk.com/threads/heritage-platinum-auction-session-5.385203/

If you use the SEARCH function with the phrase "ancient coin grading" you'll get literally hundreds of hits (albeit many from the same threads) that you can peruse at your own pace for CoinTalk members' various attitudes and insights about this topic.

Because of this you may find that there aren't a lot of responses to your original question. However, if you have some additional personal insights or thoughts about grading you might initiate some new discussions in this thread by posting them here.

 

I prefer touching them. Almost every ancient I ever got has been busted open from its tombs. And it isn't just NGC, I've had ANACS & IGC slabs too.

But I do think they have a purpose, especially with some of the huge $$$ mega rarities. If I was playing with 5 -7 figure $ coins, them being in slabs would give me some peace of mind.

But I think the biggest issue is slabbing coins worth very little $, even $1,000 ancients seem like a waste.

 

So far as my collection goes, I only buy NGC slabbed coins. I really love collecting the coins, admiring the coins, and learning about the people and history associated with them. However, I do not have the experience and/or expertise to dependably determine authenticity, condition, attributions, or issues (tooling, etc), and I have no plans or desire to put the required work into developing these skills. I'm fully aware that they are fallible just like anyone else, but the people at NGC have more expertise than I ever will, and their slabs give me piece of mind that would otherwise be lacking.

So far as touching the coins goes, it's not terribly important to me. Also, the primary enjoyment that I get out of my collection is derived from showing it to other people. Last thing that I want to do under those circumstances is worry about how they are holding the coins, whether or not they will drop them, or if they have jelly on their hands from the sandwich that they ate beforehand.

But, I do realize that there is something to be said for holding the raw coins. With this in mind, I have accumulated examples of raw coins in each denomination (except aureus) to fill a "Denominations of Roman Coins" display, which are available for people to touch if they so desire.

 

Whether someone likes slabs or not there's no arguing that yes they would. It opens up a wide range of ways for them to sell them and gives them what they need right on the label to make things easy for them. Just because a long time collector can do something or get a price for something doesnt mean an heir could and very likely wouldnt especially with ancients where its easy to talk someone out of something if they arent familiar with it

 

Grade is in the eye of the beholder and is certainly not a science in ancients, more like alchemy. For this reason I just go with what appeals to me - strike, reverse condition, good devices, patina, etc. The coins I have purchased slabbed I have freed from their restraints. While not obsessed with touching every coin there are many I do touch and sometimes photograph held between my fingers. Note that with the now popular videos of coins like you see on facebook and elsewhere someone holds them and flips the observe and reverse while taking a video with their phone.

 

I do not pay much attention to the potential financial value of coins. Yes I know, this can sound idealist but I'm now too old to change my weltanshauung. I never spent much on a coin, for I used to be a collector when I was young, but at present I very rarely acquire new coins (in 2021, only 2...). Many of my coins have been offered to me by friends or relatives who know I am interested in them and will surely appreciate this kind of present. I have also offered many coins to people I love and who are interested too. I even gave coins to a public collection that did not have a specimen yet.
All this to say that, for me, slabs are an heresy. It would be too frustrating not to hold them directly in my hand, not to have direct physical contact. As far as ancient coins are concerned, my philosophy is the same as Uncle Scrooge's.
(I am sorry, I did not find an English version of this plate) :

 

There was a time, not so terribly long ago, before the digital technology revolution took hold, creating nano-seconds flows of information, correspondence and instant gratification, when collectors ordered coins from price lists and bid on coins in auction catalogs. Coin slabs did not exist. The only grading and authentication service was the ANACS, along with some services offered by some dealers and authorities in given fields of specialization.

It is a cliché to say that life was relatively slower back then when compared to today's sometimes frantic pace. Back then, collectors would generally build their collections slowly and methodically. They acquired knowledge over time, providing them with the means to distinguish legitimate coins from fakes, to learn about die varieties, determine overall grade of a given coin, and to recognize what coins are common, scarce or rare. In short, most collectors learned to think on their own, with the assistance of references, time and experience.

Now, I am not denigrating slabbed coins, or TPG services. I think that they provide a useful service for collectors unfamiliar with a given coin, and their opinions do, for the most part, hold sway with the collecting public.

As it is with life, something is gained and something is lost. I think, on the lost side, we have a situation where coins previously collected for their value as historical, artistic merits have been reduced for many people to commodities, akin to stocks, real estate and currency speculation, including Bitcoin. The collecting of ancients, as well as other coins, is now a numbers game, in the case ancients, surface and strike conditions. Overlooked, often, are a coin's historical context and significance, as well as a coin's aesthetics. Perfection, or the approximation of it, is of tantamount concern; the presence of any flaws, wear, deposits or corrosion serve to downgrade the numbers, as I guess they should. Unfortunately, from my view, this approach has compromised and diminished the joys of collecting today and, indeed, how the public and many collectors, especially relatively new ones, view our hobby. Marketing now dominates the landscape when it comes to slabbed coins.

Let me say that I do have some slabbed ancients, all from various purchases, some of which I intend to remove, but, due to inaction on my part have not done. I have, however, removed more coins from their surrounding plastic prongs. Once I do that, and am able to hold the coin, examine it in all angles and to marvel at yet another time traveler for the collection, then the pleasure and rewards of collecting are renewed once more.

 

I think slabs are useful as training wheels and to preserve extremely high value, high grade coins. Otherwise,


Grading in particular is pretty much useless for ancients. There are far too many factors other than grade that are relevant (style, strike, surfaces, patination, colour, die wear, die damage, flan quality, centring, etc. etc.). NGC tries to capture a couple of these with numbers, which is a bit like evaluating a painting with a grade and 2 numbers: rather ridiculous!

 

Me neither, since I do not own a iphone Rather have my 70" HD TV. Just finished watching "Exodus/ Gods and Kings", the Battle of Kadesh was pretty good. Love to see a big budget version of that Battle/ which the Hittites really won/ and Cannae.

 

Grading ancient coins reminded me of this textbook in "Dead Poets Society", in which Dr Pritchard PhD explained the method for evaluating poetry.

 

Not being able to handle or touch an ancient coin removes one of the great pleasures of collecting them. 'Holding history' in one's hands is an overused cliche, but it really is a large part of this hobby's appeal. I can only imagine how sterile and clinical it must be not to do so.

 

Back to the subject. I have 300 coins in NGC/ PGGS/ ANACS/ CCCS slabs. All have one major flaw.....
The data is insufficent/ esp. PGGS. I think for the $$$ you pay to have your coin graded/ they should have complete data on label.
France/ Valois Kings
AV Ecu d'or ND/ struck 28 Feb. 1388
Charles VI "le Fol" 1380-1422
+KAROLUSEI:GRACIA:FRANCORVM:REX
Crowned Coat of Arms
+XPC*VINCIT*XPX*REGNAT*XPC*IMPERAT
Cross Fleurdelisee/ Star centre/ within Quadrilobe
St. Quentin Mint
3.96g. 28mm. 9h
Duplessy 369a Ciani 486 Fr. 291

The Canadian TPG company grades more strict/ along UK/ European standards.

However, slabs do protect your treasures better then flips/ holders. I would never ever want to handle mine, better for eyes only

 

Ah, this makes me sad. Robin Williams was one of the few celebrity deaths that saddened me greatly.

 

I'm not a fan of slabs, or grading for ancient coins either for that matter !

Reasons:

- I do like to take coins out, hold them, inspect them, compare them, make group photos, etc
- I don't buy coins based on grades. I buy them based on things like rarity, style, eye appeal
- I'm often not buying commodity coins where I could pick and choose between grades, even I was inclined to value someone else's opinion over my own. If a coin only appears once every 5/10/20 years, you either buy it or not.
- I have almost 1300 coins. 2x2 envelopes is bad enough, slabs would just be impractical

I think the time when grading for ancients was useful has long passed. It was useful pre-internet when people were buying sight unseen from mail order lists. Nowadays a hi-resolution photo, or video, tells you infinitely more than a couple of numbers.

I think my heirs will fare best I if sell my collection before I kick the bucket.