What a stunner! Therefore, not one, but two new Domitians

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Limes, May 7, 2020.

  1. Limes

    Limes Well-Known Member

    I had been looking for a Domitian for quite some time. A type that is common, but perhaps therefore more difficult to find just the right one. Recently, I finally found one that checks all the boxes. A lovely example of the Minerva-on-top-of-column-with-owl-at-feet-type. And it had the portrait style I was looking for: this elitist, haughty looking Domitian.

    But then, as I was checking out the stock of the seller, I stumbled upon the other Domitian denarius: IVPPITER CONSERVATOR. My jaw dropped, and my eyes
    radiated with enthusiasm. What. A. Reverse! I was simply blown away. What a beauty! You probably know the feeling right?

    In the end I could not decide which one to go for. Luckily, the seller made a great offer on both, and I was able to get them both.

    About the latter coin; as mentioned by @David Atherton in his gallery at FAC, the reverse possibly commemorates Domitian's escape from Vitellian forces after hiding in the Temple of Jupiter during the last days of the Civil War of 69 AD. According to Suetonius, during the fighting with Vitellius, Domitian and his uncle fled to the temple on the Capitonline hill. When their opponents entered the complex and the temple was on fire, Domitian hid with the templeguard. The next day, Domitian, disguised as a follower of Isis, could escape during a procession and hid across the Tiber.

    The reverse is also used on an aureus. Another, more rare denarius of the same reverse type, shows the eagle with it's wings fully spread horizontally. (Although in my opinion this makes the eagle look like a plucked chicken...)

    Please show your absolute stunners: the one or ones that blew you away!

    16.4.png

    16.3.png
     
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  3. J.T. Parker

    J.T. Parker Well-Known Member

    Very Nice, Limes....and I don't even collect early Roman coinage.
    J.T.
     
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  4. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    I agree, what a stunner. Especially the last one, that is.
    I envy you, and I’m happy for you. I know that feeling of getting that really great coin.

    I had a «near-stunner» experience with a Flavian coin recently. A really nice Vespasian denarius.
    What I find very appealing with this coin, is the symmetry of it. Everything is so well centered, and I find the reverse design very neat:

    44BF813D-D19E-436A-BDF8-6B96D10D4506.jpeg

    I think I got my most stunning experiences quite early in my collecting life, however.
    It was when I finally dared to start buying expensive coins. For a price of what would today be 300$, I bought this Otho back in 2007:

    17184F3A-3E88-449E-8C98-BADD2E8BB6C9.jpeg


    I remember feeling crazy for spending so much on a coin, and had a lot of discussions with myself about that. While waiting for it in the mail, I constantly looked at the auction photos. When getting it, I remember wrapping it out from the envelope, hands shaking. And after that, just looking at it again and again, thinking «This is MY coin? This is MY COIN!».

    It’s a special kind of craziness, coin collecting. But it’s a pleasant craziness.

    Congrats with the stunner!
     
  5. Tony1982

    Tony1982 Well-Known Member

    My best Domitian

    Domitian, AR Denarius, 89, Rome
    IMP CAES DOMIT AVG-GERM P M TR P VIIII
    Laureate head right
    IMP XXI COS-XIIII CENS P P P
    Minerva standing facing, head left, vertical spear in right hand, left hand on hip
    RIC 688
    EB44C6DB-8677-43AC-88E6-AF6A8DDC0F59.jpeg
     
  6. David Atherton

    David Atherton Flavian Fanatic

    Both are indeed stunning! Some very talented engravers worked on both those die pairs.

    Here is one when I received it in hand blew me away.

    T112.JPG
    Titus
    AR Denarius, 2.87g
    Rome mint, 80 AD
    Obv: IMP TITVS CAES VESPASIAN AVG P M; Head of Titus, laureate, bearded, r.
    Rev: TR P IX IMP XV COS VIII P P; Dolphin coiled around anchor
    RIC 112 (C2). BMC 72. RSC 309. BNC 60.
    Ex Harlan J Berk 143, 18 May 2005, lot 177.
     
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  7. Orfew

    Orfew Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus

    That is a very nice D144 with a great portrait. It so happens I have one of those "winging" its way to me now.

    Domitian RIC 144.png

    As for my favourite Flavian portrait...

    Domitian RIC 568.jpg

    or maybe this one...
    Domitian RIC 435 .jpg
    Nah it has to be this one...
    Domitian RIC 21.png
     
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  8. Spaniard

    Spaniard Well-Known Member

    Great looking coins!....
    I only have one Domitian at the moment but it's one of my favourite Denarius..Thanks to the man above....
    The photo doesn't give it justice as it has wonderful toning..
    domm.jpg
    Domitian. 81-96 AR Denarius (3.17 gm, 18mm). Rome mint. Struck 81 AD.
    Obv.: IMP CAES DOMITIANVS AVG P M, laureate head right.
    Rev.: TR P COS VII DES VIII P P, tripod surmounted by a dolphin right. RIC II 74.
     
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  9. Jay GT4

    Jay GT4 Well-Known Member

    Very nice! He definitely had some talented engravers. I have examples of both of your coins

    RIC 507
    normal_Domitian_COS_XIII.jpg

    And RIC 144
    normal_Domitian_Eagle.jpg
     
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  10. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Those ARE a couple of stunners, @Limes ! I love the toning on both of them.

    This one stunned me. The artwork on most coins of Faustina I is pretty crude. This one, though, caught my fancy. You can even see the ornamental jewelry woven into her hair in front of the chignon at the top of her head! The detail on Providentia is quite nice and you can see the equinoctial cross on the celestial globe in her hand! And it's an as, not a sestertius!

    Faustina Sr AETERNITAS Providentia globe and scepter As veiled bust a.jpg
    Faustina I, AD 138-140.
    Roman Æ as, 12.87 g, 26.4 mm, 6 h.
    Rome, AD 140-141.
    Obv: DIVA AVGVSTA FAVSTINA, bust of Faustina I, draped and veiled, right.
    Rev: AETERNITAS S C, Providentia, draped, standing left, holding globe on extended right hand and vertical scepter in left hand.
    Refs: RIC 1163ab; BMCRE 1459; RCV 4635; Cohen --; Strack 1230.
     
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  11. Parthicus Maximus

    Parthicus Maximus Well-Known Member

    Dat zijn inderdaad twee geweldige toevoegingen @Limes!

    If you take a closer look, there are endless portrait variations on Domitian denarii. Your examples indicate that well.
    This portrait immediately grabbed me when I saw it.
    [​IMG]
    Domitian 81-96 AD
    AR Denarius
    Struck 86 AD (second issue)
    IMP•CAES DOMIT AVG•GERM P M TR P V.
    laureate head right
    IMP•XII COS XII CENS•P•P•P•
    Minerva standing right on capital
    of rostral column, holding spear and shield, owl at foot right (M2)
    2,88g/20,5mm
    Ric 437 (R)
     
  12. Roerbakmix

    Roerbakmix Well-Known Member

    ... daar vraag je me wat!

    I've got several coins that fit in this category. This large and hefty piece of silver - my avatar coin - was actually one of my first ancients.
    Azes I-II Tetradrachme.jpg

    This extremely rare sceatta (type D, BMC 10) was recently found in the Netherlands and not recognized by the seller as a rare specimen - in fact, there are only ca. 30 known.
    [11129] Annonymous - Likely the Netherlands (AR sceatta (series D, BMC type 10), c.700-715 AD).jpg
    This denier of Charles II le Chauve, minted in Le Mans ticks most of not all boxes: a lovely patina, great detail, and an interesting period (minted only ~250 years after the crude coin above).
    [11123] Charles II le Chauve - Le Mans, France (AR Denier, 834-877).jpg

    A bit later - just a few years after the 'start' of the Holy Roman Empire, this splendid Coin of Heinrich II.
    Heinrich II.jpg

    I guess most will have developed a blind spot for this coin, which I post over and over again. It's an Ambiani Celt war stater, minted to finance the war against Julius Caesar.
    [1122] Ambiani celts - Ambiani region, (current France, near Amiens) (AV stater, 58-55 BC).jpg

    Or this recent piece of eye-candy, depicting a cool scene with two soldiers and a sow.
    [11150] C. Sulpicius, C. f. Galba  - Rome, Italy (AR serrate denarius, 106 BC).jpg


    And finally, to stay a bit on the Domitian train:
    [11140] Domitian -  (AE Quadrans, 84-85 AD).jpg
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. Limes

    Limes Well-Known Member

    thanks (en bedankt ;-)) for all the replies, and some really nice looking coins are shown!

    @Roerbakmix, interesting coins shown, although not my field of collecting. I looked a bit into that 'sceatta' coin, because of its Dutch provenance. Interesting to read a bit about the history, and I read that the word 'schat' is related to sceatta. A stunner in multiple aspects!
     
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  14. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    While we’re into the Dutch monetary history and language:
    In Norwegian there’s an expression; «ikke (not) verdt (worth) en (a) døyt (few Norwegians can explain this word)». It means «not worth anything». What it originally means, is of course «not worth a duit». Which again is, not a whole lot. :)

    (I thought I had a duit to show, but it seems to have gone into hiding. Hmmmm...
    Oh well. It wouldn’t have fit in this thread anyway. :) )
     
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  15. Limes

    Limes Well-Known Member

    Thats neat, a Dutch coin used in Norwegian language. In that sense, the duit is still used in several Dutch proverbs too. Maybe you recognize them?
    - een duit in het zakje doen. Literally: to put a duit in the bag, which means make a small contribution;
    - geen rooie duit hebben. Literally: not having a red duit, which means not having money at all;
    - de duiten bijten hem. Literally: the duits are biting him, which means he's wasting money
     
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  16. svessien

    svessien Senior Member

    We use the «red duit», only with øre (smallest of our coinage, like a cent).
    As there are no øre coins left in circulation, that will become an expression which needs explanation with time too.
     
  17. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    The Greeks and Romans used quadrans in this way! For example, Matthew 5:26 reads:

    ἀμὴν λέγω σοι, οὐ μὴ ἐξέλθῃς ἐκεῖθεν ἕως ἂν ἀποδῷς τὸν ἔσχατον κοδράντην.

    I translate this as:

    "Truly I tell you, you will not come out from there until you have paid back the last quadrans."
     
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  18. PeteB

    PeteB Well-Known Member

    TitusDenAnchor-dolphin.jpg
    Titus. 79-81 AD. AR Denarius (18mm; 3.28 gm; 6h). Rome mint. Struck January-June 80 AD. Obv: Laureate head right. Rev: Dolphin coiled around anchor. RIC II 112; RSC 309. Golden tone.
     
  19. PeteB

    PeteB Well-Known Member

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