Wanted: Flan Flaw Experts

I have this large Hadrian/Nilus AE Drachm which I bought from a highly reputable seller in Israel. Many of you would recognize his name. The coin originally had a sand patina which rubbed right off. I gave it a further light cleaning in a diluted sodium sesquicarbonate solution and the patina completely came off in 10 minutes (record time) which leads me to believe it was not original. A lot of flan flaws that were initially not obvious were revealed.

I'm curious about the areas I've numbered. No. 1 is indented and the area below it, No. 2, is raised and looks like it could have been part of No. 1. No. 5 looks smeared or crushed in some way. An odd coin. Does anyone have some ideas or opinions? Does it look authentic to you? Images enlarge greatly.Thanks in advance.

 

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I'm no expert, but it looks like a cool, authentic, old bronze Hadrian provincial to me.

 

I agree about the "originality." I'm not going to comment on the authenticity of this piece. IMO, everything you have described is normal. IMO:

At one time #1 and #2 were the same on the rim. Then #1 became corroded and it's surface is now below it's original level as struck (#2). You forgot to post about #4. Area #5 just looks corroded. I like the crack in the planchet.

What can be learned from this? Ancient coins are vastly different due to style, grade, and problems. I'll bet in most cases when we buy a coin we like the way it looks. Unless you are willing to destroy the value and appearance of a coin you like, it is best not to fool with them UNTIL you have the experience and knowledge to actually improve them. I'll bet that "before" the OP's efforts, this coin was a lot more attractive!

EDIT: Thanks @ominus1 I forgot to post that "I'm no expert but I'm going to post an opinion."

 

You might be right, but I think I bought a retouched coin. Is the seller at fault? Not necessarily. Did my efforts improve the look of the coin? Definitely no, but it revealed the flaws that were perhaps purposely obscured. Still, I appreciate your input.

 

I agree, but I wouldn't be pleased about the fake patina. Depending on the price you paid and if you like it as it is now, I would return it on principle.

 

problem is there always problems with coins, they getting older and older,
and goes in hundred years in collections

 

Bing, posted: "I agree, but I wouldn't be pleased about the fake patina. Depending on the price you paid and if you like it as it is now, I would return it on principle."

I really don't think that would work. If I were the dealer, unless I didn't wish to lose a big and frequent $$$$ customer, I'd tell him to go pound sand!! This is not the attractive coin I sold.

Let's see I buy an attractive rainbow toned dollar form you @Bing, dip it to "hairlined gray" and then wish to return it....

 

Good advice Bing.

 

coin is 1oo% original, but, my opinion, patina is fake..

 

Do you have the seller's photo of it in its "original" condition?

 

Your definition of 'highly reputable' is considerably different than mine. Those who sell 'improved' coins without proper notation deserve a reputation but not one that could be considered high.

 

Something about the obverse of this coin bothers me, and I would ask someone with real expertise (which I don't have) to comment on this.

The circled area below is a very different color from the rest of the coin; it resembles coins with defects that have been filled with epoxy -- I have seen these illustrated from time to time:



Could this coin have patched/filled?

 

I can't add any true expertise here, but have a fair number of drachms of Hadrian from Alexandria, and can speak to how some may look slightly 'odd' as a result of any combination of manufacture, wear, corrosion, or how they were 'conserved' by previous generations of collectors. I personally wouldn't be bothered by what I see on your coin even though I'd be interested in seeing those 'Before' pictures too.

Here are two of mine also with a Nilus reverse but looking quite different from each other.

 

No, this forum rates this seller as highly reputable, not just me. Couldn't the best of us buy an improved coin without knowing by mistake? Sellers too.

Thanks for the replies guys...not at all what I expected but I still appreciate it.

 

Who on this forum rates sellers that doctor their coins as highly reputable? Not I. I think your coin is genuine, and as Zumbly says, Egyptian tets can take on some pretty funky fabrics for any number of reasons. You should be aware that many Israeli dealers add fake patinas to their coins and think nothing of it. They consider it an "aesthetic." Caveat emptor.

 

Who says the seller doctored the coin? Who knows if I'm even right? Only looking for info nothing else.

 

Adding a fake patina is doctoring in my book. Perhaps we have different definitions?

 

Thanks again for the opinions. I'm still specifically interested in what you guys think about the flan flaws.

 

Interesting post, @Macromius ! I tracked down your coin and I know the dealer. I'm not defending him but IMO the Israeli dealer may have acquired the coin from someone who purchased it from a dealer who's name begins with "Z" and is NOT ZUZIM.

 

Maybe the seller purchased the coin and then sold the coin in the same condition as when purchased? Maybe the seller doctored the coin? I do not know what the coin looked like when sold to you, but as is I like it.