Very satisfied with ICG

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Owle, Feb 14, 2023.

  1. Owle

    Owle Junior Member

    Personally I would not want to buy an ICG or other coin without a return privilege. I bought some $5 Indians in old holder ICG slabs a few years ago graded MS63 which were at least a point overgraded. The question is what percentage of their graded coins are mistakes by the ANA standards? While there are plenty of dogs and problem coins in PCGS and NGC slabs they do have guarantees, and I have tried both of them, but they chintz on compensating you if they agree that the coin is overgraded or a problem coin, usually offering a very low below wholesale cash offer or they will try to get you to pay for the conservation claiming that it was someone's fault but them that it is a problem coin. And with PCGS you can easily wait 90 days for a decision on the problem coin, while NGC is faster in my experience. ICG also doesn't want to admit overgrading on guarantee submissions to them.

    I believe that ICG can definitely overgrade, maybe a half point on some coins, a nice gemmy Morgan with just too many marks for a 66 would be one example. They like originality and are prone to overlook light cleaning if the coin is otherwise acceptable marketwise from their perspective. I haven't heard how Anacs specifically is grading but a dealer I know is generally happy with them except for common Morgans that he believes they undergrade.
    longshot, mpcusa and imrich like this.
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  3. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    I think you have departed the realm of TPG objectivity and firmly claimed a space in subjectivity. That is certainly acceptable, in numismatics.

    Could you clarify your interpretation of "ANA standards"?

    Considering your (maybe valid maybe not) concerns with all the TPGs you name....and I think some of the complaints are a bit enhanced....why not collect only non-TPG pieces, since you imply a level of excellent grading skills?

    Your thread started off well and interesting, but I think you have converted to an opposite concentration.

    Would you consider sending a Box of 20 of your personally graded pieces to CAC for evaluation, as a learning exercise?
  4. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    Yes, it would for sure be cheaper but theres a reason for that when you go to sell it will be allot easier to get a premium for the same exact coin in a PCGS holder
    similar to buying generic GOLD and buying boutique the name brand will go for more.

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    And why does the "name brand" go for more? Marketing.
  6. charley

    charley Well-Known Member


  7. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    Every body is familiar with the top two
    PCGS and NGC, and I think most people
    are looking for a well known company in
    the business, resale is very important
    so when my bucket finally falls over…LOL
    my kids and grand kids will be able to
    sell what I have accumulated at a premium because it’s PCGS and not
    a lower tier grading company.
  8. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    That is only if you are buying premium examples. What happens when the company changes grading standards. Maybe starts to correct the blatant over grading. What happens to all those coins? You will be stuck with a loss.
  9. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    While I understand the inference of your comment, I would not concur, because the thrust of the mpusa post, to me, is that a TPG value is at the very minimum an opinion of more desirable quality that the marketplace trusts, via years of experience and collector response, over a non-TPG graded (generic) or alternate TPG choice that does not have the same level of collector confidence.

    That is not the same as stating that ICG and/or ANACS graded pieces are consistently less accurate. The perception of many participants in the hobby is that ANACS and/or ICG have been in the "market" for as many years, and have had the same opportunity (and more so) to "market" confidence, but have not achieved success in perception (in general) by the community of the same level of quality.

    Why do you think that is? Do you think it is because of a 180 degree shift in the pursuit of collecting in the hobby from value/investment being a secondary consideration (or, if you will, to not needing the Boy Scout Merit Badge anymore), to value/investment being the primary consideration?
  10. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    That goes for all TPG,S but if we could
    see in to the future we would all be
    Billionaires…LOL :)
  11. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    That goes for all TPG,S but if we could
    see in to the future we would all be
    Billionaires…LOL :)
  12. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    The network is acting funky, sorry for
    the multiple posts.
  13. imrich

    imrich Supporter! Supporter

    Yes, your assumption is correct! The companies, and dealers/sales outlets Et Al have supported the top-tier TPG!
  14. Owle

    Owle Junior Member

    As for ANA grading standards they are mainly a guide these days, it seems that "market acceptable" is more the standard but there is a reason for rules and standards to be a schoolmaster to guide us.

    I wish there was an independent company like cac that would review Anacs and Icg slabs, now that they are doubling their fees the high end coins are the only ones in PCGS and NGC slabs worth sending to them. And cac is going to produce the own slabs in yet another grading service. My guess for why they are doing that is that that is a business plan where they are more likely to strike it rich with a hedge fund making a huge offer to buy them out as NGC and PCGS were.
    green18 and Pickin and Grinin like this.
  15. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    If CAC is able to survive. I hope it is because they are going to correct some of the wrongs.
    No more AU coins in MS slabs. If they do that them ICG and ANACS coins will be closer to the actual grade IMO. One thing I like about ICG is they call a spade a spade and a diamond a diamond.
    IntenseBlue likes this.
  16. desertgem

    desertgem Senior Errer Collecktor

    Well, I can show several significant (same cent) doubled dies, each with a section of small "lines" which PCGS graded MS63 or better, with ICG detailing as damage. Of course I agreed with PCGS as they appeared raised from die scratches ( and worth more) :) , but I argued with Skip and he felt strongly, so I still have to credit his reasons. ICG gives a lot of effort in their grading and the price is quite fair, so it is a good test run for higher valued coins, imo. Jim
  17. lardan

    lardan Supporter! Supporter

    After reading all of this there were many good comments and opinions. I think this "boils down" to what feels right for you. I think to a certain degree one might have to consider more if they are an investor or collector. We too are certainly planning on leaving our collection to our kids. My wife and I are the ones that spent the money for the coins we have, so they better not complain about inheriting some coins in ICG or ANACS slabs instead of NGC or PCGS,
    KBBPLL and Kentucky like this.
  18. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    I don’t think they will complain to much..LOL, there getting something
    for free and that’s always nice :)
  19. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    I don’t think they will complain to much..LOL, there getting something
    for free and that’s always nice :)
  20. mpcusa

    mpcusa "Official C.T. TROLL SWEEPER"

    What is up with this network. ? I post
    one thing and get four posts instead
  21. imrich

    imrich Supporter! Supporter

    Regardless of CAC being required to deliver an opinion on some of the "top tier TPG" coins being slabbed with terrible bag rub/marks/wear on GEM+ or AU graded Gold coins, they still are an improvement.

    I've hundreds of "beaned" coins waiting for their new service which I believe will be a further advancement above a bean being given when the coins are rated against the current average of grades given by a specific TPG.

    green18 likes this.
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