VARIETY: 1941-S Large "S" Jefferson Nickel FS-501

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Lehigh96, Sep 12, 2012.

  1. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    That's the large "S"
     
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  3. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    BINGO! Correct answer and pretty good description of the two. See how easy it is?
     
  4. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    :facepalm::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious: or in the same amount of time it takes to read the first five words of this very scholarly approach you can look at the mint mark (no measurements required) and know which size "S" it is. :jawdrop: Just saying...no logic needed but thanks anyway. :yawn:
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2016
  5. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    So lets' regroup for a bit, and reconsider what we're sure of.

    TJ's coin has a mint mark of the same size and physical placement as a PCGS-attributed FS-501. That much is proven to me beyond a doubt. It appears to have serif structure - yes, I agree on that - which isn't characteristic of the Large S.

    The Large S variety has a mint mark vertical height of 77% of the height of the nearby window in Monticello. The Small S has a proportion of ~61.5% of the same window. Here they both are, at scale:

    1941Sexamplesmlmms.jpg

    Wouldn't be hard to tell they're different.

    I don't know about you, but I'm seeing a bit of serif structure on the bottom of this second Large S example I posted last - which, by the way, is one of the plate coins for FS-501 at Coin Facts - reminiscent of the Small S serif. I wonder what happened to the shape of the mint mark as the die wore.

    One thought I'm not discounting is that we don't yet know of all the MM punches used at San Francisco in 1941, although the precision of the MM placement argues against a heretofore-unknown die.
     
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  6. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    We do know that the OP said only one revers die had a Large "S." That needs to be confirmed.
     
  7. Christobal

    Christobal Well-Known Member

    My only input to this concern is that I've found a number of small S 1941s and just one large S. As I've been through a good many boxes of nickels in the past few years, probably at least 35 per year, this suggests to me that there weren't many large S dies used for that coin. It wouldn't surprise me if there was just one or two. Observational data bears this out.

    As for all of the talk about is it or isn't it, simply compare 5 1941-S coins together. If all 5 S's are the same size, you almost certainly have small S coins. :)
     
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  8. TJ1952

    TJ1952 Well-Known Member

    Could you please post a picture of what you believe is your 41 large S?
     
  9. Christobal

    Christobal Well-Known Member

    You'll have to wait a week, I'm afraid. I'm away from home this week. Sorry!
     
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  10. TJ1952

    TJ1952 Well-Known Member

    No problem. Thanks!
     
  11. jackhd

    jackhd Active Member

    Not afraid to engage. A wise knows when to walk away. I've simply come to the point where I realize I am completely out of my element. Also, I'm not prone to linger once a coin project stops being fun.

    Call it cowardice if you like, more accurately, I've kinda lost interest and the ultimate answer sort of stopped being important to me. If I have inaccurately placed a large S MM Jeff Nickel in my Dansco, instead of a small S MM, so what!

    TJ - This is all YOUR FAULT (lol)! Jack
     
    TJ1952 likes this.
  12. TJ1952

    TJ1952 Well-Known Member

    I hear you Jack. I should submit the damn thing and be done with it!

    This thread was actually started back in Sept 2012! Maybe there's a reason @Lehigh96 hasn't responded since Nov 2015. This thread is probably old news. tj
     
  13. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    Yeah, it's almost like someone has been looking for the large S for a while, and can't admit that you have found a worthy example. @TJ1952
     
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  14. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    Dreamin, I'm always dreamin, dreamin, hopeing to find....Searchin, I'm always serchin, searchin, hoping to fine, a real one, really a real one, a real one none can deny. So keep on searchin, keep right on searchin, cause TJ you must be blind. :hilarious::hilarious::hilarious::hilarious:

    Dear friend (?), I couldn't resist. Now please describe the two "S" varieties in words for us so you'll save your authentication fee and be able to buy more coins!;)

    I waited until you went to bed to post this :D
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2016
  15. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    Well? The correct positioning and the size of the S were posted in the beginning of this thread. An overlay was used to confirm TJ1952 post, using a top tier example. I don't think there is anything more to talk about.
    Unless He gets it attributed.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2016
  16. Insider

    Insider Talent on loan from...

    :rolleyes: What part of this, from the member who made the overlay is not understood? :facepalm:

    It's like, the fellow with the 1909-S VDB but the "S" does not look right. Duh, because it's not an SVDB! His coin is a 1909 VDB with an added "S.":(

    TJ's coin is a small "S". :(
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2016
  17. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    Getting a better idea why I have that member on Ignore? :)
     
    Insider likes this.
  18. TJ1952

    TJ1952 Well-Known Member

    What member do you have on ignore?
     
  19. SuperDave

    SuperDave Free the Cartwheels!

    Insider. I have little use for those who do not allow fact to influence their opinions.

    If it quacks, it's a duck. The mint mark on your coin is of the same size and in the same location as a Large S. It isn't shaped the same way, although the PCGS coin I posted has hints of something similar.

    I'm not declaring specifically what it is, just that blindly calling it a "Small S" based purely on the shape is to deny fact.

    In fact, right now the strongest hypothesis - the one which accommodates all the known facts - is that it's a previously-unknown mint mark punch as large as a Large and shaped like a Small. But all the facts we have on your coin are based on relatively small and undetailed images, and aside the size of the MM there's nothing else I can base concrete opinions on.
     
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  20. TJ1952

    TJ1952 Well-Known Member

    Okay thanks! Yes, you're articulating my thoughts as well. I'm trying to be open minded and see all opinions. I don't want to be bias because it's my coin.
     
  21. mark_h

    mark_h Somewhere over the rainbow

    Is the coin in a grade that might make it worth a grading fee? One way to figure this out. :)
     
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