Unsold but Not Unworthy

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by David Atherton, Jan 15, 2022.

  1. Mr.MonkeySwag96

    Mr.MonkeySwag96 Well-Known Member

    One of my favorite Republican denarii issued by M. Plaetorius M.f. Cestianus depicts Jupiter’s eagle standing on a thunderbolt:

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    M. Plaetorius M.f. Cestianus Ar. denarius, CESTIANVS, behind winged bust of Vacuna, wearing crested helmet r., quiver and bow on shoulder, cornucopiae below chin, SC before, rev., M PLAETORIVS M F AED CVR (fragmented), eagle on thunderbolt with hd. l. (Seaby, Plaetoria, 4). 3.99 g

    Ex. CJ Martin on Vcoins.com

    Apparently, M. Plaetorius M.f. Cestianus’s denarii were inspired by the eagle & thunderbolt motif on Ptolemaic tetradrachms:

    [​IMG]

    PTOLEMY I SOTER AR silver tetradrachm. 294-285 BC. Diademed head right, wearing aegis around neck; small Δ behind ear, banker's marks in right field. Reverse - BAΣIΛEΩΣ ΠTOΛEMAIOY, eagle standing left on thunderbolt; to left, P above Φ in left field. Svoronos 263; SNG Copenhagen 70; BMC p. 15, 16. 26mm, 13.5g.

    Ex. Incitatus Coins on Vcoins.com

    I recently purchased a denarius of T. Carisius depicting a Sphinx. Considering that the Sphinx has the wings of an eagle, does it count as a bird of prey?:

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    Moneyer issues of Imperatorial Rome. T. Carisius. 46 BC. AR Denarius (20mm, 3.83 g, 3h). Rome mint. Head of Sibyl Herophile right, hair elaborately decorated with jewels and enclosed in a sling and tied with bands / Sphinx seated right. Crawford 464/1; CRI 69; Sydenham 983; Carisia 10. Good VF, toned, areas of flat strike.

    From the Demetrios Armounta Collection. Ex Baldwin’s 57 (23 September 2008), lot 59.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2022
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  3. ambr0zie

    ambr0zie Dacian Taraboste

    @David Atherton - that's not good at all. Do you have the possibility to take a photo at 10x? I would be interested to see how an obvious tooling looks like - these are, for me and I'm sure I'm not alone, some big challenges in ancient coins collecting
    - noticing traces of tooling/smoothing
    - (not related) identifying forgeries
     
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  4. dltsrq

    dltsrq Grumpy Old Man

    What looks like a fish in the dolphin's mouth is actually the rostrum (snout) and pectoral (front) fins of the dolphin. Dolphins were often depicted in this formalized way. Compare the mosaic below or google 'ancient dolphin art' for more:
    1_pxWn8yjSYasoAXuLrvQITQ.jpeg
     
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  5. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Even if you plan to keep it as a space-filler, I'd write to CNG to express my disappointment that the tooling was not disclosed in the coin's description in the auction listing. They are not some fly-by-night eBay operation; they should know better.
     
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  6. John Anthony

    John Anthony Ultracrepidarian

    CNG is very good about taking returns, no hassles. You don't need the lesson to be expensive. Give them a call and send it back.
     
  7. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Here's a couple of Alexandrian coins with raptors on the reverse.

    [​IMG]
    Cornelia Salonina, AD 253-268.
    Roman billon tetradrachm; 8.96 g, 21.7 mm.
    Egypt, Alexandria, AD 266-267.
    Obv: ΚΟΡΝΗΛΙΑ CΑΛⲰΝЄΙΝΑ CЄΒ, diademed and draped bust, right.
    Rev: Eagle standing left, wings open, holding wreath in beak, L IΔ before, palm behind.
    Refs: Dattari 5345; BMCG 2278; Köln 2977; Milne 4151; RCV 1071.

    [​IMG]
    Cornelia Salonina, AD 253-268.
    Roman billon tetradrachm; 9.95 g, 22.3 mm.
    Egypt, Alexandria, AD 267-268.
    Obv: ΚΟΡΝΗΛΙΑ CΑΛⲰΝЄΙΝΑ CЄΒ, diademed and draped bust, right.
    Rev: Eagle standing right, wings open, holding wreath in beak, L IЄ before, palm behind.
    Refs: Dattari 5346; BMCG 2280; Köln 2983; Milne 4189; RCV 10723.
     
  8. Bronwen

    Bronwen Member

    Thank you. It took my eyes several seconds to rearrange the coin image, but I was finally able to see it. I'm used to seeing antique representations of dolphins, but not usually with the pectoral fin that way.

    @ambr0zie I think the Grumpy Old Man is correct & you can stop castigating yourself for missing what might have been a significant detail.
     
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  9. panzerman

    panzerman Well-Known Member

    Over past ten years, I picked up 55 coins that remained "Unsold" all where fantastic deals and never regretted buying them. Here is one of them....from Bru/ Wellco Auction.
    Aquitaine
    AV Salut d'or ND Saint Lô Mint
    Henry VI (House of Lancaster)
    Coin with Eagle.... IMG_0607.JPG IMG_0608.JPG IMG_0210.JPG IMG_0211.JPG
     
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