Log in or Sign up
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
TRIVIA: A Thaler You May Not Know Exists
>
Reply to Thread
Message:
<p>[QUOTE="Clinker, post: 1246352, member: 6229"]<font face="arial"><font size="4">It's called the <b><i>Albertusthaler</i></b></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><b><i> </i></b></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><b><i></i></b>Here's an excerpt from Treasure Realm:</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">"Albertusthaler - A large silver thaler first coined in the Spanish Netherlands in 1612 during the stadtholdership of Archduke Albert and his wife Isabella. It was minted at 9.35 to the fine mark, and had a gross weight of about 29.5 grams. It soon found favor in trade with the East Indies and with Eastern Europe (Russia), and was therefore continued in Belgium until the end of the 18th century, being also widely copied in other German states as late as the early 19th century. The main identifying feature is the reverse showing a flowered St Andrew's cross of Burgundy, three crowns in the upper angles, and the lamb of the Order of the Golden Fleece pendent.</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">{From <i>Albertus</i> the Archduke who authorized the coins + <i>thaler</i> THALER.}"</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">It has another name (also from Treasure Realm):</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">"Patagon - A variant name for the <b><i>albertusthale</i></b>r. Generally valued at 50 Dutch stuebers in later years.</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">[Belgium, German States, Liege]"</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">Some facts about the Spanish Netherlands:</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">The <b>Spanish Netherlands</b> (Dutch: <i>Spaanse Nederlanden</i>, Spanish: <i>Países Bajos españoles</i>) was a portion of the Low Countries controlled by Spain from the sixteenth to the eighteenth century. When part of the Netherlands separated from Spanish rule and became the United Provinces in 1581 the remainder of the area became known as the Spanish Netherlands and was still under the control of Spain.</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">The Spanish Netherlands originally consisted of the whole of the</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><br /></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">1. County of Flanders, including French and Walloon Flanders</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">2. County of Artois</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">3. City of Tournai </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">4. Cambrai (roughly the Department Nord and the northern half of Pas-de-Calais in modern France) </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">5.Duchy of Luxembourg </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">6. Duchy of Limburg </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">7. County of Hainaut</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">8. County of Namur</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">9. Heerlijkheid2 of Mechelen (officially a county since 1490) </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">10 Duchy of Brabant </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">11. The Upper Quarter (<i>Bovenkwartier</i>) of the duchy of Guelders (around Venlo and Rosemond, in the present province of Dutch Limburg, and the town of Geldem in the present German district Kleve)</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4">The capital was Brussels in Brabant.</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><i> </i></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><i> </i></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><i></i>Here's some Patagon (Albertusthaler) Coin photos courtesy of Coin Archives. Coin Archives refers to the Albertusthaler coins as Patagon</font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"> </font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u>Patagon during Albert and Isabelle's reign (1598-1621):</u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u>1619 Patagon - Belgium (Antwerp Mint):</u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997230&AucID=926&Lot=53&Val=7335e8ba4a2a8600b17d2058836b81fe" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997230&AucID=926&Lot=53&Val=7335e8ba4a2a8600b17d2058836b81fe" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997230&AucID=926&Lot=53&Val=7335e8ba4a2a8600b17d2058836b81fe</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Undated 1/4 Patagon Belgium (County of Flanders):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Undated 1/4 Patagon Belgium - Brabant (City of Tournai):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Undated Patagon - Duchy of Brabant:</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1020613&AucID=937&Lot=1080&Val=1904110c2ea4faff879d214962843917" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1020613&AucID=937&Lot=1080&Val=1904110c2ea4faff879d214962843917" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1020613&AucID=937&Lot=1080&Val=1904110c2ea4faff879d214962843917</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Undated 1/4 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant and Flanders:</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=948657&AucID=703&Lot=2432&Val=d5240d668ea5af3cb2bf58046abcd182" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=948657&AucID=703&Lot=2432&Val=d5240d668ea5af3cb2bf58046abcd182" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=948657&AucID=703&Lot=2432&Val=d5240d668ea5af3cb2bf58046abcd182</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Undated Patagon Belgium-Tournai (City of Tournai):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956942&AucID=708&Lot=2605&Val=6146a5b77add0e0eb1cda813797a5e36" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956942&AucID=708&Lot=2605&Val=6146a5b77add0e0eb1cda813797a5e36" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956942&AucID=708&Lot=2605&Val=6146a5b77add0e0eb1cda813797a5e36</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">Patagon coinage in other parts of the Spanish Netherlands:</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4">1619 Patagon - County of Flanders (Brügge Mint):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025016&AucID=942&Lot=1090&Val=f6faa3e5f2889337be05ecfff6828cb6" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025016&AucID=942&Lot=1090&Val=f6faa3e5f2889337be05ecfff6828cb6" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025016&AucID=942&Lot=1090&Val=f6faa3e5f2889337be05ecfff6828cb6</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4">1622 1/32e de Patagon - Bourgogne (Dole Mint):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988308&AucID=918&Lot=920&Val=a2722caa8fc5c5772c68d3b98a03ae8e" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988308&AucID=918&Lot=920&Val=a2722caa8fc5c5772c68d3b98a03ae8e" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988308&AucID=918&Lot=920&Val=a2722caa8fc5c5772c68d3b98a03ae8e</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4">1627 Patagon - Bourgogne (Dole Mint):</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988306&AucID=918&Lot=918&Val=51e60885e77f2894b6cc75a99f4b06d0" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988306&AucID=918&Lot=918&Val=51e60885e77f2894b6cc75a99f4b06d0" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988306&AucID=918&Lot=918&Val=51e60885e77f2894b6cc75a99f4b06d0</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1631 Patagon - City of Tournai:</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032137&AucID=949&Lot=1948&Val=abb93e8551dfa0e328647a4c171517e4" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032137&AucID=949&Lot=1948&Val=abb93e8551dfa0e328647a4c171517e4" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032137&AucID=949&Lot=1948&Val=abb93e8551dfa0e328647a4c171517e4</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1631 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Brussel Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015404&AucID=936&Lot=1402&Val=78aab60cb29207eb051d4719ffbf402d" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015404&AucID=936&Lot=1402&Val=78aab60cb29207eb051d4719ffbf402d" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015404&AucID=936&Lot=1402&Val=78aab60cb29207eb051d4719ffbf402d</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1632 1/4 Patagon - Duchy of Luxembourg:</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997326&AucID=926&Lot=149&Val=11086edfecf0330052136df98b63e9b6" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997326&AucID=926&Lot=149&Val=11086edfecf0330052136df98b63e9b6" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997326&AucID=926&Lot=149&Val=11086edfecf0330052136df98b63e9b6</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1632 1.4 Patagon - County of Flanders (Brugge Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015403&AucID=936&Lot=1401&Val=781636c3e5cd3dbfe0364438d8ae203f" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015403&AucID=936&Lot=1401&Val=781636c3e5cd3dbfe0364438d8ae203f" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015403&AucID=936&Lot=1401&Val=781636c3e5cd3dbfe0364438d8ae203f</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1635 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032136&AucID=949&Lot=1947&Val=9683f3246f439332b877da1179765b1d" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032136&AucID=949&Lot=1947&Val=9683f3246f439332b877da1179765b1d" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032136&AucID=949&Lot=1947&Val=9683f3246f439332b877da1179765b1d</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1642 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Brüssel Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025008&AucID=942&Lot=1082&Val=47869758a4ceb170dc9c9cf9ea7508f1" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025008&AucID=942&Lot=1082&Val=47869758a4ceb170dc9c9cf9ea7508f1" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025008&AucID=942&Lot=1082&Val=47869758a4ceb170dc9c9cf9ea7508f1</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1645 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1004914&AucID=931&Lot=8545&Val=cab5bf18d237bfeb96c6d9c7129193b4" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1004914&AucID=931&Lot=8545&Val=cab5bf18d237bfeb96c6d9c7129193b4" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1004914&AucID=931&Lot=8545&Val=cab5bf18d237bfeb96c6d9c7129193b4</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1646 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025010&AucID=942&Lot=1084&Val=0971913080b46ddefc3ff938760dbc69" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025010&AucID=942&Lot=1084&Val=0971913080b46ddefc3ff938760dbc69" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025010&AucID=942&Lot=1084&Val=0971913080b46ddefc3ff938760dbc69</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u>1655 1/2 Patagon - Belgium-Brabent (Brussel Mint):</u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u> </u></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><u></u></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1034182&AucID=954&Lot=2053&Val=da2828bbb558a2faeef3ed627e136260" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1034182&AucID=954&Lot=2053&Val=da2828bbb558a2faeef3ed627e136260" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1034182&AucID=954&Lot=2053&Val=da2828bbb558a2faeef3ed627e136260</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4">Under French Annexation 1659 Patagon - Besançon:</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988302&AucID=918&Lot=914&Val=66f5133c318a880cd2c1d27abea9df2e" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988302&AucID=918&Lot=914&Val=66f5133c318a880cd2c1d27abea9df2e" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988302&AucID=918&Lot=914&Val=66f5133c318a880cd2c1d27abea9df2e</span></font></span></font></u></a><font size="4"></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"><br /></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4">Under French Annexation 1662 Patagon - </font></u><font size="4">Besançon:</font><font face="Times New Roman"></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"><br /></font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=990850&AucID=921&Lot=904&Val=5380d89110e23d51697cb09aa0efe5cc" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=990850&AucID=921&Lot=904&Val=5380d89110e23d51697cb09aa0efe5cc" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=990850&AucID=921&Lot=904&Val=5380d89110e23d51697cb09aa0efe5cc</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><u><font size="4">Under Roman Empire 1710 Patagon:</font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"> </font></u></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><u><font size="4"></font></u><a href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=950168&AucID=703&Lot=3943&Val=4e3bf71202509eb9bad55be93c7c9d23" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=950168&AucID=703&Lot=3943&Val=4e3bf71202509eb9bad55be93c7c9d23" rel="nofollow"><u><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff"><font size="4"><span style="color: #0000ff">http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=950168&AucID=703&Lot=3943&Val=4e3bf71202509eb9bad55be93c7c9d23</span></font></span></font></u></a></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font face="Times New Roman"></font><font size="4">Hope you enjoyed meeting the <b><i>Albertusthaler</i></b> (<b><i>Patagon</i></b>),,,</font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"> </font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4">Clinker</font></font></font></p><p><font face="arial"><font size="4"><font size="4"></font></font></font>[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="Clinker, post: 1246352, member: 6229"][FONT=arial][SIZE=4]It's called the [B][I]Albertusthaler [/I][/B]Here's an excerpt from Treasure Realm: "Albertusthaler - A large silver thaler first coined in the Spanish Netherlands in 1612 during the stadtholdership of Archduke Albert and his wife Isabella. It was minted at 9.35 to the fine mark, and had a gross weight of about 29.5 grams. It soon found favor in trade with the East Indies and with Eastern Europe (Russia), and was therefore continued in Belgium until the end of the 18th century, being also widely copied in other German states as late as the early 19th century. The main identifying feature is the reverse showing a flowered St Andrew's cross of Burgundy, three crowns in the upper angles, and the lamb of the Order of the Golden Fleece pendent. {From [I]Albertus[/I] the Archduke who authorized the coins + [I]thaler[/I] THALER.}" It has another name (also from Treasure Realm): "Patagon - A variant name for the [B][I]albertusthale[/I][/B]r. Generally valued at 50 Dutch stuebers in later years. [Belgium, German States, Liege]" Some facts about the Spanish Netherlands: The [B]Spanish Netherlands[/B] (Dutch: [I]Spaanse Nederlanden[/I], Spanish: [I]Países Bajos españoles[/I]) was a portion of the Low Countries controlled by Spain from the sixteenth to the eighteenth century. When part of the Netherlands separated from Spanish rule and became the United Provinces in 1581 the remainder of the area became known as the Spanish Netherlands and was still under the control of Spain. The Spanish Netherlands originally consisted of the whole of the 1. County of Flanders, including French and Walloon Flanders 2. County of Artois 3. City of Tournai 4. Cambrai (roughly the Department Nord and the northern half of Pas-de-Calais in modern France) 5.Duchy of Luxembourg 6. Duchy of Limburg 7. County of Hainaut 8. County of Namur 9. Heerlijkheid2 of Mechelen (officially a county since 1490) 10 Duchy of Brabant 11. The Upper Quarter ([I]Bovenkwartier[/I]) of the duchy of Guelders (around Venlo and Rosemond, in the present province of Dutch Limburg, and the town of Geldem in the present German district Kleve) The capital was Brussels in Brabant. [I] [/I]Here's some Patagon (Albertusthaler) Coin photos courtesy of Coin Archives. Coin Archives refers to the Albertusthaler coins as Patagon [U]Patagon during Albert and Isabelle's reign (1598-1621): 1619 Patagon - Belgium (Antwerp Mint): [/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997230&AucID=926&Lot=53&Val=7335e8ba4a2a8600b17d2058836b81fe"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997230&AucID=926&Lot=53&Val=7335e8ba4a2a8600b17d2058836b81fe[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Undated 1/4 Patagon Belgium (County of Flanders): [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Undated 1/4 Patagon Belgium - Brabant (City of Tournai): [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956939&AucID=708&Lot=2602&Val=b27d810912318c98a14b44dc7cc1614d[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Undated Patagon - Duchy of Brabant: [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1020613&AucID=937&Lot=1080&Val=1904110c2ea4faff879d214962843917"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1020613&AucID=937&Lot=1080&Val=1904110c2ea4faff879d214962843917[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Undated 1/4 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant and Flanders: [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=948657&AucID=703&Lot=2432&Val=d5240d668ea5af3cb2bf58046abcd182"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=948657&AucID=703&Lot=2432&Val=d5240d668ea5af3cb2bf58046abcd182[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Undated Patagon Belgium-Tournai (City of Tournai): [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956942&AucID=708&Lot=2605&Val=6146a5b77add0e0eb1cda813797a5e36"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=956942&AucID=708&Lot=2605&Val=6146a5b77add0e0eb1cda813797a5e36[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [U][SIZE=4] Patagon coinage in other parts of the Spanish Netherlands: 1619 Patagon - County of Flanders (Brügge Mint): [/SIZE][/U][SIZE=4] [/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025016&AucID=942&Lot=1090&Val=f6faa3e5f2889337be05ecfff6828cb6"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025016&AucID=942&Lot=1090&Val=f6faa3e5f2889337be05ecfff6828cb6[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4]1622 1/32e de Patagon - Bourgogne (Dole Mint): [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988308&AucID=918&Lot=920&Val=a2722caa8fc5c5772c68d3b98a03ae8e"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988308&AucID=918&Lot=920&Val=a2722caa8fc5c5772c68d3b98a03ae8e[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4]1627 Patagon - Bourgogne (Dole Mint): [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988306&AucID=918&Lot=918&Val=51e60885e77f2894b6cc75a99f4b06d0"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988306&AucID=918&Lot=918&Val=51e60885e77f2894b6cc75a99f4b06d0[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1631 Patagon - City of Tournai: [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032137&AucID=949&Lot=1948&Val=abb93e8551dfa0e328647a4c171517e4"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032137&AucID=949&Lot=1948&Val=abb93e8551dfa0e328647a4c171517e4[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1631 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Brussel Mint): [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015404&AucID=936&Lot=1402&Val=78aab60cb29207eb051d4719ffbf402d"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015404&AucID=936&Lot=1402&Val=78aab60cb29207eb051d4719ffbf402d[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1632 1/4 Patagon - Duchy of Luxembourg: [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997326&AucID=926&Lot=149&Val=11086edfecf0330052136df98b63e9b6"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=997326&AucID=926&Lot=149&Val=11086edfecf0330052136df98b63e9b6[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1632 1.4 Patagon - County of Flanders (Brugge Mint): [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015403&AucID=936&Lot=1401&Val=781636c3e5cd3dbfe0364438d8ae203f"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1015403&AucID=936&Lot=1401&Val=781636c3e5cd3dbfe0364438d8ae203f[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1635 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint): [/U] [/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032136&AucID=949&Lot=1947&Val=9683f3246f439332b877da1179765b1d"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1032136&AucID=949&Lot=1947&Val=9683f3246f439332b877da1179765b1d[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1642 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Brüssel Mint): [/U] [/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025008&AucID=942&Lot=1082&Val=47869758a4ceb170dc9c9cf9ea7508f1"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025008&AucID=942&Lot=1082&Val=47869758a4ceb170dc9c9cf9ea7508f1[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1645 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint): [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1004914&AucID=931&Lot=8545&Val=cab5bf18d237bfeb96c6d9c7129193b4"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1004914&AucID=931&Lot=8545&Val=cab5bf18d237bfeb96c6d9c7129193b4[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1646 Patagon - Duchy of Brabant (Antwerp Mint): [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025010&AucID=942&Lot=1084&Val=0971913080b46ddefc3ff938760dbc69"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1025010&AucID=942&Lot=1084&Val=0971913080b46ddefc3ff938760dbc69[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [SIZE=4] [U]1655 1/2 Patagon - Belgium-Brabent (Brussel Mint): [/U][/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1034182&AucID=954&Lot=2053&Val=da2828bbb558a2faeef3ed627e136260"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=1034182&AucID=954&Lot=2053&Val=da2828bbb558a2faeef3ed627e136260[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4]Under French Annexation 1659 Patagon - Besançon: [/SIZE][/U][SIZE=4] [/SIZE][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988302&AucID=918&Lot=914&Val=66f5133c318a880cd2c1d27abea9df2e"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=988302&AucID=918&Lot=914&Val=66f5133c318a880cd2c1d27abea9df2e[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL][SIZE=4] [/SIZE][FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4]Under French Annexation 1662 Patagon - [/SIZE][/U][SIZE=4]Besançon:[/SIZE][FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4] [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=990850&AucID=921&Lot=904&Val=5380d89110e23d51697cb09aa0efe5cc"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=990850&AucID=921&Lot=904&Val=5380d89110e23d51697cb09aa0efe5cc[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][U][SIZE=4]Under Roman Empire 1710 Patagon: [/SIZE][/U][URL="http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=950168&AucID=703&Lot=3943&Val=4e3bf71202509eb9bad55be93c7c9d23"][U][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff][SIZE=4][COLOR=#0000ff]http://www.coinarchives.com/w/lotviewer.php?LotID=950168&AucID=703&Lot=3943&Val=4e3bf71202509eb9bad55be93c7c9d23[/COLOR][/SIZE][/COLOR][/SIZE][/U][/URL] [FONT=Times New Roman] [/FONT][SIZE=4]Hope you enjoyed meeting the [B][I]Albertusthaler[/I][/B] ([B][I]Patagon[/I][/B]),,, Clinker [/SIZE][/SIZE][/FONT][/QUOTE]
Your name or email address:
Do you already have an account?
No, create an account now.
Yes, my password is:
Forgot your password?
Stay logged in
Coin Talk
Home
Forums
>
Coin Forums
>
Coin Chat
>
TRIVIA: A Thaler You May Not Know Exists
>
Home
Home
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Activity
Recent Posts
Forums
Forums
Quick Links
Search Forums
Recent Posts
Competitions
Competitions
Quick Links
Competition Index
Rules, Terms & Conditions
Gallery
Gallery
Quick Links
Search Media
New Media
Showcase
Showcase
Quick Links
Search Items
Most Active Members
New Items
Directory
Directory
Quick Links
Directory Home
New Listings
Members
Members
Quick Links
Notable Members
Current Visitors
Recent Activity
New Profile Posts
Sponsors
Menu
Search
Search titles only
Posted by Member:
Separate names with a comma.
Newer Than:
Search this thread only
Search this forum only
Display results as threads
Useful Searches
Recent Posts
More...
