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Message:: [QUOTE="GDJMSP, post: 730194, member: 112"]Yeah I know. And I used to argue the point that the TPG's did not go through periods of tightening and lossening, that they held the line on standards and that it was the people submitting the coins who were making the mistakes by either over-estimating or under-estimating the grade of the coins they were submitting. That's because for the vast, vast majority of the time (from 1986 to 2006 or thereabouts) I agreed with the grades assigned by the TPG's. It has only been in the past couple of years, getting close to 3 now, that I began to disagree with the grades assigned far more often than I agreed with them. You said once Mark, not long ago, that you thought the TPG's had started tightening grades about 15 years ago. Would you still agree with that estimate or am I misremembering ?  I do agree with you that if the coins are resubmitted in their holders that they will not be downgraded. But the prevailing trend is for resubmitted coins to be cracked out for people seem convinced that submitting coins in their slabs, whether it be for cross-over or upgrade consideration, creates a bias for the graders. I guess time will answer the question just like it always does. For we will either see a period that is directly opposite the theory of "coins in old slabs" upgrading becoming instead the theory of coins in newer slabs downgrading. Or - we will see a period of coins never, or hardly ever upgrading and the grades will remain static for a period again. And I don;t have the direct experiencre either since I have never submitted a coin in my life. All I can do is report what others say. And I don;t think you can argue that others are saying that the TPG's have been tightening their standards. Yeah I know you've said that they price coins Mike. But if your assertion that the standard doesn't change, that only the price changes, is correct then how do you explain the many knowledgeable people who claim that the TPG's go through periods of tightening or loosening standards ? After all, you can't tighten standards unless they were previously loose. And I don't think even you would ever claim that the TPG's have never done anything but tighten standards over the years. For if that were true, we would never see an over-graded coin. We would never see 66's and 67's. Grade-flation would not, could not exist. And even you admit that grade-flation does exist. The huge changes in the population numbers absolutely confirm that there are far more higher grade coins now than there were just a few years ago. Want the proof, go look at the Heritage auction archives, there is your proof. The auction records from 2004 to 2006 have the pop reports from back then. Compare them with the pop reports of today. The evidence is there, all you ahve to do is look at it. And is it just pure coincidence that the reports of the TPG's tightening standards always seems to coincide with the market dropping ? Is it pure coincidence that these reports of tightening drop off to nothing when the market is rising ? No Mike, I don't think it is coincidence at all. You have long said that the TPG's price coins, or rank coins - whatever you want to call it - instead of grading them. And I used to argue that point, saying that they graded them. But in the past few years I have to admit I have changed my mind to agreeing with you - that they do price coins. And that the grades are determined according to those prices. You see, we have come full circle. You now sound like I used to. You now make the same arument that I used to make. Funny how that happens isn't it.[/QUOTE]

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