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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;Insider, post: 2711569, member: 24314&quot;][USER=15199]@desertgem[/USER] Thanks for the gentle reminder.&nbsp; I like the example of the poison bottle trick in the chem class!&nbsp; </p><p><br /></p><p>I believe this is a very informative thread in spite of my colorful posts...BTW, I was calling the <b>dealer</b> out for giving one of our members (who has probably learned more about ancients in six months of collecting than I ever will) false information - not the member.&nbsp; </p><p><br /></p><p>It is very sad to me that the younger generation has gone &quot;soft.&quot;&nbsp; When I was learning about coins in seminars, the best teachers I had were constantly hurling &quot;curved-balls&quot; and &quot;fast-balls&quot; at us.&nbsp; Think about it.&nbsp; Just about every dealer in the coin business has the ability to try to put one over.&nbsp; If we let our guard down...This applies to the TPGS&#039;s too.&nbsp; Inattention and naked-eye grading are two reasons &quot;state-of-the-art&quot; counterfeits and repaired coins get slabbed as genuine. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie57" alt=":jawdrop:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />&nbsp; That is often pointed out in this forum.</p><p><br /></p><p>I enjoy a challenge; however, as I wrote on another thread, if I post any more coins in the future, I&#039;ll take your suggestion along with the wishes of the majority <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie3" alt=":(" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> and play it straight <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie23" alt=":bigtears:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />, dry, no fun <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie4" alt=":mad:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />, and no challenge. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie40" alt=":dead:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p><br /></p><p>This is exactly what all collectors should be like.&nbsp; SHOW ME OR FORGET ABOUT IT! That is the way I am too. <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie2" alt=";)" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> As for providing an example for you...I lose.<img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie57" alt=":jawdrop:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /> There is no way to tell that an alteration was made forty years ago without access to old auction catalogs, records from 1970&#039;s era certification services that authenticated these coins (INSAB or ANACS), and lots of research.&nbsp; Furthermore, I no longer have access to ancient coins on a daily basis as I did working for two ancient coin dealers decades ago. However, I will guarantee I can walk the floor of any Ancient Coin Section at a major show and scoop up dozens of physically-altered silver or gold ancients that are being sold as original!&nbsp; Since we don&#039;t know when they first got on the market (1940&#039;s to present day) you can forget about that statement also as I cannot prove it in person.</p><p><br /></p><p>As for books...<b>There are none</b> that I have seen and counterfeit and altered coins are a passion of mine. &quot;<i>Classical Deception</i>&quot; by Sayles is the only one that comes to mind and that deals with counterfeits. I recollect that only one page is devoted specifically to alterations (I&#039;m too lazy to get up and check on this).&nbsp; There are lots of bibliographies/references in that book that may contain some specific information on tooled gold and silver ancients.&nbsp; </p><p><br /></p><p>I think the reason no one has written a book about tooled gold and silver is because much of it has gone undetected for many years except for &quot;smoothing&quot; <img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie52" alt=":hilarious:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /><img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie52" alt=":hilarious:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /><img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie52" alt=":hilarious:" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />&nbsp; There is another thing to consider. IMHO, only a few engravers of today have the skill of their 18th and 19th century counterparts or the famous forgers of ancient coins.&nbsp; Additionally, why tool a genuine gold or silver ancient when a very deceptive copy can be produced (tool the transfer die) that will fool just about everyone for awhile - even in Europe.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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