To slab or not to slab

If I understand you correctly, since the data from @Jaleus poll may not be statistically valid, it should be discounted. OK, I can see your logic. Then how do you propose we evaluate the different opinions on this subject?

 

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In all fairness not discounted, but it shouldn't be looked at as anything more than what the small number of posters here responded as. In general internet polls are very easy to manipulate, but I don't think this is a subject matter that would get that kind of attention for that.

Given that collecting is often times a more behind the scenes thing, the market as a whole is the best we can really do. We can see places like eBay, Heritage, GC and so on and the data does show NGC isn't in a league of their own anymore and the country can and does matter for who is preferred.

 

Your argument seems to be both that my opinion is unduly influential to the people on the site, and also that the opinions of the collectors on the site are irrelevant.

My opinion is only that, but it does seem to be corroborated by the vast majority of collectors here. Why is your minority opinion any better?

 

It’s already been explained before. Your poll reflects the opinions here, here is a microcosm of collecting and the actual market.

Your poll has 32 votes including one that said other, if you can’t see why that isn’t relevant to the market as a whole or world wide I can’t really help at this point. That’s like taking a poll of your next door neighbors and thinking it’s relevant across the country

 

You didnt answer my question. Also, this site has advanced collectors and industry experts from all over the world. Sure, we're missing the vast majority of "what's a slab?" collectors, but the poll results here are that of a more informed population and the sample is very relevant.

 

Because most of us use punctuation. And can spell works like Nickel.

 

Not to mention many people give bogus replies to polls that ask stupid questions, are phased poorly or otherwise annoy me.

 

@baseball
I don’t have a horse in this race. I don’t collect high grade world coins and to be honest, don’t really care who’s right or wrong. However, what I see is that every time something negative is said about PCGS, you jump in as the PCGS apologist.

When I first joined CT, I read your posts and could tell that you were an experienced numismatist and had respect for your opinions. You can’t fake it on these forums. However, I keep you seeing you defending PCGS on every little thing. On some previous posts it may have been warranted, but for this one, I’m hard pressed to think that you’re nothing more than a PCGS employee. I know it sounds ridiculous, but I can’t think of any other rational explanation for your recent posts. IMO, that’s killing your credibility here. I don’t have an axe to grind, just trying to provide my opinion as objectively as possible for this type of discussion.

Hope this helps explain my thoughts. I haven't read anything in this thread that would sway an informed opinion, so I think it's time to check out

 

He's @baseball21 but yeah... Don't tell him his kid is ugly.

 

The sample here of all of 30 something so far is a sample of this site nothing more. It's not rocket science figuring out why that isn't relevant on the whole.

The only reason that happens is because of the other posts and group think. I knew where you were attempting to go with the posts but discussed rational with you anyways. This site for whatever reason has many people that are just anti PCGS and a lot of feelings come out as opposed to the actual market or the current realities. I make up my mind based off the market.

Unlike some (most?) I have actually used PCGS, NGC, ANACS, ICG, and CAC multiple times for each one. My opinions come from what the market shows not feelings or people being upset they didn't get the grades they wanted.

As I have said many many time I dont work for PCGS nor do I even live remotely close to them and that sort of nonsense just proves the group-think disease that is present that that's the go to for many posters as opposed to actually looking into things.

One of the reasons why I stepped back from this site and only participate in certain threads (baseball talk was what kept me signing in) is the group think and the strong biases of it. People should get accurate information about how the market views things, that has always been my big thing. I'm not in the inner circle here or the preferred opinions so people get upset and circle the horses.

The market shows what is really is going on. Forums are fun, but a microcosm of reality. When group think is putting outdated opinions or incorrect information someone should try and correct it.

 

You know I'm a PCGS member as well as NGC, right? I don't by any means dislike PCGS. I use them for most US coins, and I think their service for world tokens and medals is superior to NGC. There is only one series of world token that I still use NGC for, and it is because I started the series with NGC many years ago. All new world tokens and medals worth slabbing I send to PCGS.

As far as not getting the grades I want from PCGS for world coins, you're right, but it's because their grades are too high. I don't want an MS64 in a PCGS MS66 slab. I cross PCGS world coins down when they go to NGC, and they come back with grades that are more in line with reality.

As for reality, most world collectors prefer their coins raw. Most world slabbers are US collectors and dealers who are used to slabbing, with some foreign submitters looking to increase the liquidity of their coins on online marketplaces. The nuances between the TPGs for this purpose is mostly an argument between advanced world collectors in the US, which is exactly what you have on cointalk. I wonder, if the poll results so far supported your assertions, would you be so quick to dismiss it?

 

I do which is why it was shocking to see such condemning opinions coming from you. I'm not going to repeat myself again I'm not the one who advocated a hardliner position against PCGS or NGC.

I wasn't speaking directly at you rather in general. This is a good example of one of the problems though with these forum polls and discussions, its not personal nor always direct but people will respond as it was to defend their opinion.

Again nothing but your opinion. I won't even get into the whole misnomer that there is a correct grade to begin with.

No, you have a handful of people that engage on the forum. There are multitudes more world collectors and advanced world collectors that don't post here. Forums can be fun, but the majority of collectors couldn't care less at any level

Without question, I dismissed the results at first sight and have long dismissed the notion that a poll or opinion here is evidence of the market. There are just to many areas here where the market goes against popular opinion and more importantly the poll itself is not significant as I spoke of above.

Regardless of outcome polls here are reflective of opinions here nothing more

 

So I guess the only real statistic is the actual numbers of world coins slabbed by each NGC and PCGS. Money talks and that statistic, if even available now that population reports of # of coins slabbed by type seems to be uber secret, will reflect what the opinion of the market really is.