To CAC or not to CAC - official game thread

Somebody paid over $900 for THAT 1851 half cent! That's worse than a burial; it's an implosion. It took at least TWO people with more money than brains to get to that level. The coin is on the Gray Sheet for $150. Using Gray Sheet numbers, you have to get up MS-65, Brown have one that's worth $900.

I bought this one from the coin counter at the Gimbels Department Store in Philadelphia in the mid 1960s. They graded it VF. It's now in an NGC MS-62 holder. It runs circles around that 1851, and it's a slightly better date than the 1851. When I was collecting half cents, my conclusion was that the 1851 was the most common date for the decade.

 

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Now you know why I totally regretted paying $230 for that coin. I don't know what I was thinking at the time. Actually, I wasn't thinking.

 

Looks like it's my turn. This one made a trip to CAC a while back. Did it bean?

 

Summary

Rd. 1: 1921 MS 65 Green CAC Morgan--> Yes: 4 vs No: 3

Rd. 2: 1835 AU 50 Green CAC 50c--> Yes: 2 vs No: 8

Rd. 3: 1939-S Oregon MS 65 Gold CAC 50c--> Yes: 10 (8 Green and 2 Gold) vs No: 0

Rd. 4: 1838 AU 58 Green CAC (Gold $5)--> Yes: 1 vs No: 5

Rd. 5: 1908 MS 63 Green CAC (Gold $20)—> Yes: 5 vs No: 1

Rd. 6: 1885-CC MS 63 PL Green CAC Morgan--> Yes: 8 vs No: 1

Rd. 7: 1946-S MS 66 Green CAC Walker 50c--> Yes: 7 (6 Green and 1 Gold) vs No: 1

Rd. 8: 1885-S MS 62 NOT CAC Morgan--> Yes: 5 (4 Green and 1 Gold) vs No: 1

Rd. 9: 1830 EF 45 UNKNOWN CAC 50c--> Yes: 10 vs No: 1

Rd. 10*: 1899 MS 65 BN UNKNOWN CAC 1c--> Yes: 4 vs No: 5

Rd. 11: 1942 MS 65 Gold CAC 50c--> Yes: 4 (4 Green and 0 Gold) vs No: 2

Rd. 12: 1940-D MS 67 Star UNKNOWN CAC 10c--> Yes: 3 vs No: 4

Rd. 13*: 1884-O MS 61 Gold CAC $1--> Yes: 9 (4 Green and 5 Gold) vs No: 0

Rd. 14: 1827 AU 55 CAC 10c--> Yes: 1 vs No: 7

Rd. 15: 1851 MS 66 CAC 1c--> Yes: 5 vs No: 4

Rd. 16: 1919-S MS 65 Green CAC 10c--> Yes: 12 (11 Green and 1 Gold) vs No: 0

Rd. 17: 1922 MS 65 NOT CAC Peace $1--> Yes: 10 vs No: 1

Rd. 18: 1851 Au 58+ CAC 1/2C--> Yes: 0 vs No: 6

Green CAC on coin and deserves it: 6
Green CAC on coin and doesn't deserve it: 4
Gold CAC on coin and deserves it: 1
Gold CAC on coin but should only be Green: 2
Gold CAC on coin but should not sticker:
Failed to sticker but deserves a sticker: 2
Failed to sticker and should not sticker:
Unknown sticker status and deserves a sticker:1
Unknown sticker status and does not deserve a sticker:2


Note: if we don’t know the status of a coin before the reveal and more people say green CAC for a gold CAC coin, then it will go in the area of “Gold CAC on coin but should only be Green” ....see round 3 as the example case

*
Rd. 10 was 4-4...I interpreted that CircCam would consider it a no (based on a similar example), which swayed the overall vote to a lean towards no.
Rd. 13 was tied between green and gold at 4-4...I interpreted that geekpryde would consider it a gold

 

It happens to all of us. I have mentioned before that I also bought a half cent that had a CAC sticker (MS 64 CAC) and was unimpressed by it (lack of luster). I bought mine for less than it had sold at Heritage (via eBay auction) and then sold it for even less.

 

Now onto the 1839-O 50c...

I'll say Green CAC
(looks appropriate as a 53 to me)

 

1839-O half dollar?

Yes

 

I'd give the 1839-O a definite green bean. Very nice looking coin. I'd even trade my half cent for it!

 

I also want to add, this is a very worthwhile thread and am glad it got started and hope it keeps going strong; hopefully with more participants.

 

Nice coin. I think if this was a 55 I would have said it had a green bean so I think it has a gold bean.

 

That brings up a question from me. Would CAC give a gold bean for an AU53 coin they thought should be AU55? What are their rules for non-MS coins?

 

It’s about time I played. It got a green sticker.

 

Gold is hard to come by and is not given just because a coin may be one grade higher. I have heard that a gold sticker may be given if the coin would green sticker at the next point grade.

 

Technically it should be the same at any grade level as for MS (a green sticker in the next grade as mentioned by @kSigSteve above). However, I've heard some mention that for a low AU (50/53) to go gold, it would have to be AU 58.

 

I think you know that CAC ignores the "+" so they felt that it warranted the AU58 grade. So you are saying they got it correct? But maybe I misunderstood your post...

jom

 

1839-O: I'm going to go out on a limb here as say it failed the Green bean. My guess is that they thought it was cleaned and retoned. Often they fail coins that are good for the grade but have other "problems" (in their opinion). Here's it's a cleaning (dipping probably) and retone.

It's going out on a limb thinking maybe the photo doesn't show the issue. It's a hunch that based on my many failures at CAC with coins of this era.

jom

 

I was saying that PCGS shouldn't have given it a "+".

 

I’m going to agree with jom on this one. Failed due to old clean and retone I see a few light hairlines in the left obverse that say it might have been wiped years ago

 

I agree that there should be no Bean on the 1839O half. It was dipped or cleaned and retoned.

But the die cracks all over both sides are fantastic!

 

Since I've seen several responses on the 1938-O half about it being dipped I have a question. Shouldn't it be assumed that many early American coins have been dipped/cleaned at some point in time and that many in straight graded in slabs have been dipped/cleaned many years ago?