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Message:: [QUOTE="GoldFinger1969, post: 2094986, member: 73489"]But Eddie, don't MS grades already ALLOW for some wear as long as it's not circulation wear (however we define it)? If a coin could not have ANY wear and still be considered Mint State....there could be only 1 Mint State grade, right ?  No degrees of Mint State.  MS-70 or otherwise we go straight down to AU-58. Let's assume that the ANA and TPGs did not write the rules with outliers in mind. By that, I mean that a 'circulated' coin is one that actually circulates and doesn't go from the Philly Mint to my hand and then to a candy store where it sits in the back of the coin register for a year with much less 'wear' than a coin that sits in a bag in the Philly Mint and gets banged around weekly as it's shuffled around the building. Let's also assume the a circulated coin shows LOTS of wear on ALL high, medium, and even low points.  There are degrees, but let's assume it's a circulated coin in the normal sense:  wear on all high points, wear on some medium points, luster/shine mostly or all gone.  So it's not like a silver quarter that almost is smooth but it's begun the process in a small way. Let's also assume that bag marks and high-wear are pretty much what happens when you sit in a Mint bag. Let's not assume the outlier that a coin in such a bag can, over time, get more overall damage and wear than a normally circulated coin. Let's also assume that a CIRCULATED coin shows wear all over....and thus, most if not all of the luster/shine would be gone...a condition NOT seen on Mint State coins with minor wear and the majority of their luster/shine in Gem Quality MS-65 or above. If you take my assumptions above...and apply the ANA Standards AS THEY WERE INTENDED....you come up with what I think is this logical conclusion:  all the 'experts' at that time wrote grading standards that could be written in 2-3 pages rather than the Encyclopedia World Book because they assumed that all of the conditions that give a coin a demerit -- wear, loss of shine/luster, bag marks, dings, scratches, etc. -- would increase at a CONSTANT LINEAR RATE that did not allow for outliers. <ul> <li>They didn't assume a circulated coin would have all or most or even some shine and luster</li> <li>They didn't assume a Mint State coin would have NO wear on high points.</li> <li>They didn't assume that ANY wear would mean you go from Mint State (presumably only MS-70) all the way down to AU.</li> </ul>Here's how Wikepedia summarizes the various Mint States, presumably from the ANA and PCGS (I went to Barnes & Noble to get the ANA book tonight but they didn't have it so I'm using this as my proxy): <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheldon_coin_grading_scale#Uncirculated_grades" target="_blank" class="externalLink ProxyLink" data-proxy-href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheldon_coin_grading_scale#Uncirculated_grades" rel="nofollow">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sheldon_coin_grading_scale#Uncirculated_grades</a> Note the specific number of contact marks/blemishes allowed as you move down from MS-70. I share the concerns of some here about loose grading standards, market grading, and grading on a curve.  But I think the LITERAL and RIGID application of an interpretation of the ANA standards and TPGs procedures would result in a radically re-designed grading system that would have more unhappy people than we do today. Let's Fight The Real Enemy: counterfeit coins and counterfeit slabs !!!<img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie8" alt=":D" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" /><img src="styles/default/xenforo/clear.png" class="mceSmilieSprite mceSmilie8" alt=":D" unselectable="on" unselectable="on" />[/QUOTE]

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