Thought I was getting the hang of this, now I'm completely lost

Discussion in 'What's it Worth' started by Kevinfred, Dec 23, 2013.

  1. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    I try not to bug you all with coin after coin, but this one sure has taken me for a loop... As I mentioned, I *really* thought I was starting to understand at least a LITTLE bit on grading. After getting this today I'm about ready to give up. I just don't know what else to do? I certainly can't hang out in the PCGS grading dens... Anyway, please guess the grade on this - I'll post the grade after a handful of posts. Thanks a lot and Merry Christmas all!

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  3. Kirkuleez

    Kirkuleez 80 proof

    I guess AU-53. Don't give up.
  4. bkozak33

    bkozak33 Collector

    ms61 maybe cleaned details
  5. vdbpenny1995

    vdbpenny1995 Well-Known Member

  6. saltysam-1

    saltysam-1 Junior Member

  7. bsowa1029

    bsowa1029 Franklin Half Addict

    Really hard to tell from scans. 64?
  8. Tom B

    Tom B TomB Everywhere Else

    You need to edit the cert number out, too, or else it is trivial to plug the number into the cert verification database to see the assigned grade.
  9. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    Good call, forgot about that, but everyone here is honest right?
  10. kynagr

    kynagr Member

    my guess is ms 63
  11. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    I say AU58. It has the look of an overdipped coin but it may have escaped a GENUINE holder.
  12. silentnviolent

    silentnviolent accumulator--selling--make an offer I can't refuse

    I think the breast feathers bring it down to a 58 as well
  13. cpm9ball

    cpm9ball CANNOT RE-MEMBER

    MS Details - Genuine (Improperly Cleaned)

  14. jolumoga

    jolumoga Active Member

    I believe the details are MS quality. I do not see the wear that others see. In fact, what seems to be missed quite often in my amateur opinion is that the strike may be weak, making a coin appear to be worn when it is not. I think the breast feathers on the reverse are well-defined (especially compared to other coins of the same type), as are other high points such as the hair on the obverse. I'm no expert, but I think, assuming it has not been cleaned, it should get a high grade. The problem is that the coin seems to have a dull or flat luster.
  15. Kirkuleez

    Kirkuleez 80 proof

    I think what most people are missing, or are seeing as overdipping, are exactly the qualities that an AU coin should display. I went with AU-53 because it the coin clearly shows light wear on the top portion of the hair line and shows underlining luster overall. Most notably, the stars show luster underneath with what looks dark surrounding them. Over dipping would remove this feature and give the coin a washed out look overall.
  16. jolumoga

    jolumoga Active Member

    I looked at other 1880-O MS coins on eBay and in my humble opinion this coin has details at least as good as those, if not better in key areas. My guess would be MS61-63, assuming it has not been cleaned, which would mean a details grade. The lack of luster could be from cleaning, which might give it a details grade. If it turns out that this coin was graded AU, I would consider resubmitting it because, again, plenty of MS coins on eBay have less detail, in my view. If my assessment turns out to be wrong and it was graded AU with overwhelming agreement among the experienced members here that it is AU, then I'm in the same confused boat as the OP! :)
  17. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    I can't WAIT to tell you all, I'll post grade photo in a few hours when I get home - thanks all!!
  18. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Kevin - when you're done with guesses, please explain why you say you are lost.
  19. BUncirculated

    BUncirculated Well-Known Member

    I can see wear in the hairline over the ear and other areas, bag marks both sides, it does look like it was cleaned.

  20. wcoins

    wcoins GEM-ber

    PCGS Genuine
  21. Kevinfred

    Kevinfred Junior Member

    Well guys here it is - I'd love some after thoughts/discussion - Doug, despite countless helpers trying to explain/show me luster breaks, I just can't see them. As I mentioned to another member... AU53-MS63 coins just all look the same to me. I just don't see these 'luster breaks' which most tell me is the reason why coins such as this one is graded lower. I mean, I'm looking at this coin and a PCGS MS62 right now and the detail is exactly the same.

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