Just thought I would relay what I have heard from some club members. We have one member with some deep pockets, (owns an octodrachm and an Eide Mar), and he said he was completely shut out in Germany this spring. He said there is a Shiek who is on a buying spree for Greek coins, and bought up about 3/4ths of all Greek material at the current auctions. He said that some bidders were bidding up $5000 coins up to $50,000 just to spite him, and it didn't phase the shiek at all. Just thought I would pass this bit of info along, and it might help explain some things if anyone is into better ancient greek coins and are having a hard time finding material. I hear they believe he will be showing up at the ancient auction at CICF, if not they are sure a representative or two will be there. With such a thinly traded market, this can and has happened in the past. I guess the only thing to do is hope he doesn't take an interest in your area, and wait for him to become disinterested or die. King Farouk immediately comes to mind. Chris
This just happened pretty recently. I also heard he was the buyer of the Judea Capta that was was appraised at 5k and sold for over 100k. Of course there was another bidder to get it up that high. Just passing along what the deepest pockets I personally know of what has been going on at auctions. This gentlemen had a rep, (big name people would recognize), and a budget of about 100k for lots he was interested in and walked away empty handed, and I hear many others did as well. Maybe just fuel for the rumor mill, but this friend is the real deal, (have seen many of his coins), and do not know why he would say this otherwise. It has not been in any press over here either. Was King Farouk named when he was buying out auctions in the 30's?
Yep, "The Sheik" drove up the prices at the January Triton XIV auction too. Here's an example, $10,000 estimate, sold for $180,000! I would think that on a very good day it would go for $20K to $25K. But $180,000! http://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=175198 I was told by a dealer at that auction that 2 bidders got into a bidding war and put most the coins out of reach of anyone else. - One was "The Sheik", who didn't care what it cost. - The other was a Japanese businessman with deep pockets who just started collecting ancient coins and had no experience or idea of the value of the coins. This according to my dealer friend who talked with him after. All of my bids were blown out of the water even though they were high bids on mid-level coins. It will be a rude awakening when they try to sell them though. :too-funny:
Or the coins will command a premium once they become certified through a grading service as owned by "Sheik Deep Pockets!"
I like that! :too-funny: But I imagine coin collecting is just a temporary distraction for the idle rich sheik and he will get bored with it quickly and move on to something else.
I think many 'collectors' miss three big points here. First, money is only important to people who have less than they would like to have. When you actually believe that you have more money than you need, you see no problem paying ten times what 'little people' believe it is worth. "If you have to ask the price, you can't afford it." Second: Agents follow instructions. If I tell you to buy something at any price, you'd better buy it. This only gets noticed when two different guys butt heads on the same coin. When you really want something on eBay, you can bid $1000 and hope no one else bids so the thing will be yours for the $1 opening bid. Either way you get the coin you wanted. Third: Some people actually like their coins for what they are not for their profit potential. If, all of a sudden, coin prices dropped to 1911 price levels, some of you would be suicidal while others would go on a buying spree getting things that they always wanted but could never afford. Just hope that when the Shiek gets bored that he sells the coins for 1/10 what he paid rather than melting them.
Well I understand why some of you may think this is simply rumors. I firmly believe it since I know the collector involved, I know he can afford serious money, and I know the agent, (he hasn't represented me, he represents for people paying serious money, and he works for a MAJOR US ancient firm), and they are simply telling me with a straight face what is happening with high end Greek coins. I was just passing it along. Doug is right, the mindset of "cost" is not the same for them as us. Someone drops 23 million on an auction season. If they are worth hundreds of millions, and making tens of millions a year, its not a big concern especially if they believe they have invested in an asset.
i will sell the sheik my collection of english shillings from elizabeth I to elizabeth II for £500,000 i may even throw in a 2010 5 pence piece as a bonus. believe me guys coin news has a very detailed european auction report each month and there is absolutely no mention of our middle eastern friend.
Just as a follow up, (especially for those who mocked my information), Baldwin's has now sued this buyer for non-payment of millions of dollars in bids. The Sheik bought more than half the auction of Baldwin's in the spring and has not yet paid. I have talked to others who also are sitting on millions of receivables from this buyer. The Baldwin's lawsuit is public information in the UK, so anyone wishing to throw stones at this information can feel free to look it up themselves.
Oooops. So much for my idea of "now's a good time to SELL some of your nicer ancients". I expect this sort of thing on eBay, but it's strange to think of someone being able to capsize an entire market without the intent or ability to make good on bids...
No, the rest of the market is strong, just look at early Roman that this particular buyer has never bought. There is still a lot of money flowing into all collectibles. My only intent was to help shed a little light if people were seeing outstanding Greek coins going crazy. Heck, I know the identity of the main underbidder as well, and he is not going anywhere, except for a cup of nice hot cocoa up to the 30th story, (insiders will get the joke I hope). The market is strong, and will continue to be strong, it just has been abnormally strong for a few years just because of one buyer. If this one buyer goes away, maybe they will go back to "normal" strong levels.
