The secret to collecting key dates (The elusive AU64 slider)

I agree. But I like the words "choice primo AU's" better.


I think the concept behind this post can be applied to more that just choice AU coins. Even thought they demonstrate the concept perfectly. I know some can't afford AU's and should look for the best representative coin of the grade they are looking at. I have seen some AG's that I like better than good's and very good's. So on and so fourth. And remember eye-appeal is in the eye of the beholder.

 

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Jack is right on, AU64 is a conceptual grade not an actual grade. However, there are AU58 coins residing in both NGC and PCGS MS64 Holders. These AU coins are market graded by the TPG's because the TPG believes strongly that the coin will be valued in the market place they same as an actual MS64. I don't have an example of one, but I do have an example of an AU58 that could very easily be in an MS63 holder. The following coin is a key date 1921-D Walking Liberty Half Dollar.




You may ask why this coin was not included in the OP. The answer is simple, it sold for $10,925 which is just below the wholesale value of an MS63 at $11,250. BTW, Numismedia wholesale for an AU58 is $3,850. IMO, anyone who believes in market grading should not be upset if this coin resided in an MS63 holder, because that is what it is worth. This coin is the quintessential AU64.

 

Great post LeHigh you explained your position well , maybe they should make AU-64 a real grade . A 64 with a touch of wear .
rzage

 

Now, there gang.

If only PCGS would learn this concept of accurate grading and let the market decide the value, rather than trying to sneak in and skew the value by " market grading ".

This is a perfect example of better consistancy from NGC and more accurate grading than PCGS. I just had a back and forth privatly with GD on this.

 

In this particular case, I think your position is correct. After all, the Walker is in an AU58 slab and it still brought MS63 money. It would suit me just fine if the TPG's only market graded with respect to the elements of grading (luster, strike, and eye appeal) and let the actual market decide the price of the coin.

 

superb post!
I like the concept of AU-64.

I know Jack always looks for these at shows. lol

 

wait, a lesser grade coin might have more eye appeal than a higher grad coin? no freakin way

i have several slider Walkers that i chose over higher graded coins because they look awesome and cost a fraction of the high grade dream coin. spending the time to look at coins is well worth it and that's why i hold off on key dates - i want to really understand a series before i spend my money.

-Steve

 

LOL, I'm sure. But I rather look at it like we love to learn and are out to sharpen our understanding. And we don't do that by laying down and agreeing with something we don't happen to agree with but rather by questioning that which we don't happen to agree with. Such challenges, of course, are the natural result of our ability to think and reason. Those, OTOH, who, for whatever reason, fail to question/challenge, as such (I would say, anyway) do not think...and, therefore, according to guys like Descartes, for example, are not. Cogito ergo sum...ya know?

 

I agree not only with everything you just said and the aptness of your illustration, but with your understanding of what "market grading" is, and how and why it could very easily place this coin in that MS-63 holder. FWIW, Lehigh...

 

Wow! Great post! I too like the "AU-64" concept!

 

occulus taori

 

Sorry we don't serve octopus; would you like to try a fillet of fish sandwich?

 

thats latin for bulls eye sigh!

 

I love it! Filed away for future reference... :thumb:

 

Great post and it has changed my thinking on my future purchases of key dates.

 

I do too. I love it. For that matter, we could take it all the way to AU69 as far as I'm concerned.

It's well established around here that many great coins are available in AU58 holders, and those coins have far greater eye appeal than many low end MS coins.

It's a shame that the math "60 is greater than 58" distorts perception in the Sheldon numbering system. But it's not really Sheldon's fault.

Back when the dominant method of describing grade was adjectival (Good, Very Fine, etc.), the Red Book listed AU prices lower than low end Unc. That has been reinforced by every price guide I've ever seen... they all imply that MS is better than AU. Perhaps the "MS > AU" custom predates the Red Book.

We all know that's not really appropriate, as this thread shows so plainly.

Nice work, Lehigh ! :thumb:

 

Some day, in the not too distant future I believe that coin grading will consist of a laser running across the surface of a coin and a mathmatical algorithim will grade them. When this is perfected, there will be no more subjectivitiy, and the same grade will be returned every time.

 

Nice concept, but don't think so. We have had this discussion on the board a couple of times. There are somethings a computer will not be able to handle - like eye appeal, weak strike versus wear, bag marks versus normal tick marks, etc. I think it will be longer than "not too distant future".

 

Great post. Now I have to go and change my coin spreadsheet to move some of the AU58's to AU-64's.