The Monster Toned Coin Game Thread

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by ddddd, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    Considering the term "monster toned" is very prevalent but also often misapplied, I thought it would be interesting to see what CoinTalk members would call a variety of different toned coins.

    My idea is to focus on Morgans (since those are the coins most often tagged with this term) but we can include other coins as well.

    First here is the resource on which I'm modeling the scale (what scale? ....keep reading! :D).
    http://www.jhonecash.com/coins/tonedmorgans.asp

    The basic rules:
    1. A coin will be posted and everyone can provide an opinion of what level the toning merits.
    The levels are:
    Low-End..1
    Low-Mid ..2
    Mid..........3
    Mid-High...4
    High.........5
    Monster.....6

    2. Everyone will have around 24 hours to give an opinion (can be extended if there is low participation).
    3. After the coin is called, we will average the responses and provide a CoinTalk score. I'll use one decimal place for rounding (i.e. 4.67 becomes 4.7); the rounded score has to clear the number to be that level (meaning 3.96-4.94, which round to 4.0-4.9 all fall within Mid-High).
    4. Along with calling the coin, the original poster has to provide their score (the idea is that we can compare our own score vs the group).
    5. Please comment if you want to post next.

    -the count of what happened will look as follows:
    Example: 1881-S Morgan PCGS MS65...CT -> 4.7 (Mid-High) vs You -> 5 (High)
     
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  3. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    And using the aforementioned website, I will include some examples of each level (this is just for reference and you don't have to agree with their standards)...Note: I just included one of each, the link has more examples.
    http://www.jhonecash.com/coins/tonedmorgans.asp

    Low-End-1
    [​IMG]

    Low-Mid-2
    [​IMG]

    Mid -3
    [​IMG]

    Mid-High-4

    [​IMG]

    High -5
    [​IMG]

    Monster -6
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2020
  4. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I will kick off the first round with this Morgan (I will reveal my score once this round is called):

    IMG_E5253.JPG
    IMG_E5254.JPG 801728-1.jpg
     
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  5. ddddd

    ddddd Member

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  6. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    1883o Morgan. MS 63*

    5.3 Subtle but extremely intense toning. Very even progressive rainbows. A very desirable, premium toned coin. 7-10x premium.
     
    ddddd likes this.
  7. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    @Morgandude11 and others the decimals are only when I take the average at the end. You can use them but I will end up rounding your assessment down to nearest whole number (i.e. 5.1-5.9 all will be counted as a 5).
     
  8. Morgandude11

    Morgandude11 As long as it's Silver, I'm listening

    Ok. 5.0
     
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  9. Evan8

    Evan8 A Little Off Center

    I dont think the color is vibrant enough to designate high end. I am seeing some dull grey splotches throughout Liberty's face and hair. Maybe it's just the pics, but I'm gonna give it a 3.0 mid.
     
    Cheech9712 likes this.
  10. toned_morgan

    toned_morgan Toning Lover

    That toning 1. is looking very artificial and 2. seems to be fading the luster out. I'm going to say between 3 and 4, so how about a nice 4. It might be the way the pictures are taken, but I'm, seeing subdued luster.

    Also, I don't really agree with John's examples of the levels. If it's based off of beauty, then yeah that's correct, but if it's based on how much it adds to the final price of the coin, then I think the example of 1 should be near 2 and the 3 should be closer to around 4 or 5. The 5 and 6 examples are nearly identical, and I guess the grade might be the only difference.

    By the way, can I post next?
     
  11. ldhair

    ldhair Clean Supporter

    I'll go with 3. Pretty coin.
     
  12. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    Yes you can go next.

    As for the examples, I think they are fairly decent. 1 is dark and not very attractive. 2 has a small patch of color which puts it where it is. 3 is nice but doesn't have the right mix of colors to go higher. 5 and 6 are similar but 6 has colors that "flow" better and it is a higher grade (which helps keep the distractions down and keep the focus on the color). I would also be fairly confident that the sale prices would go in the same order (the 1 example would sell for the least while the 6 example would sell for the most).

    Edit: also the posted example is MA (market acceptable); I would not call it AT. The luster in general on New Orleans toned Morgans isn't as strong as on San Francisco minted coins (and that plays a role in more high end and monster coins being from San Fran).
     
    toned_morgan likes this.
  13. toned_morgan

    toned_morgan Toning Lover

    I did not know that about the luster from San Francisco. That's interesting... I wasn't calling it AT, but just saying that it looked like the countless AT coins I have seen on eBay. I guess it might just be the pastel rainbow colors. I'm more used to liking the deeper toned coins. Thanks and tell me when I can post the next coin so I don't rush ahead.
     
    ddddd likes this.
  14. ddddd

    ddddd Member

    I'll call this one around 8 PM Central time tomorrow and tag you to post the next one.
     
    toned_morgan likes this.
  15. CircCam

    CircCam Victory

    I call it a 3 on the monster scale, and I like the scale but will say there incredible coins out there even in high gem grades that would be a 3 on it. In terms of eye appeal I rate it very highly and not “mid” at all. Love that coin!
     
  16. longshot

    longshot Enthusiast Supporter

    I'm somewhere between 4 and 5.
    I'm leaning to 4.
     
  17. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    Ok, I'm not criticizing here, but I just want people to have a little background story regarding that website. All of the content related to coins on Jhon E Cash's website is the work of Brandon Kelley (poorguy on PCGS board). Brandon was the operator of Anaconda Rare Coins website in the early 2000's and Adrian Crane was the owner. For whatever reason in 2007-8, Adrian closed up shop and relocated to somewhere in Latin America (Costa Rica IIRC), and Brandon moved on to start his own business called Polaris Numismatics. After a few years, he teamed up with Jhon E Cash who was exclusively a Paper Money seller and Brandon updated the website and created all of the numismatic content on the site.

    Regarding the coin in question, I think you have some valid points. It does look like the luster is subdued and the assigned grade given the abundance of color and lack of major marks makes me think your are correct that the luster is off. That said, I don't think the toning is artificial, and I don't think it is a bag toner. The coin appears to have toning created by either and album or a folder as the peripheries are more extensively toned than the centers. Also, bag toners usually are only toned on one side, maybe with a blush or small area of toning on the other. This coin is blanketed with toning on both sides.

    Lastly, if my Battle Creek Pink Eye Dollar is going to be the standard for what constitutes a Mid-High 4 coin, then this coin can't rise above Mid 3.

    [​IMG]

    PS. I don't like the example for Monster-6, that particular coin was the cornerstone of the Sunnywood collection and is essentially the finest rainbow toned coin in existence. It used to be in PCGS MS68 holder, but it would not surprise me if it has upgraded to either MS68+ or MS69. I remember thinking that if I had unlimited funds that I would pay 6 figures for that coin alone. Using that coin as the standard would mean that no other coin would be a monster.
     
  18. Lehigh96

    Lehigh96 Toning Enthusiast

    Btw, I have owned scores of rainbow toned Morgan Dollars over the years and still have photos of all them even though I only own two. If we ever have trouble getting a new entry, tag me, and I will post one to keep the thread going.
     
    Morgandude11, ddddd and toned_morgan like this.
  19. wxcoin

    wxcoin Getting no respect for 64 years

    I'd give the obverse a 5 and the reverse a 3 with a net of 4.
     
  20. wxcoin

    wxcoin Getting no respect for 64 years

    I'd give the obverse a 5 and the reverse a 3 with a net of 4.
     
  21. wxcoin

    wxcoin Getting no respect for 64 years

    Excuse the three posts. I was dropping my phone when selecting reply and it must have selected it 3 times. I'm glad I wasn't buying TP.
     
    900fine and toned_morgan like this.
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