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<p>[QUOTE="NicholasMaximus, post: 4514245, member: 111966"]Great Thread! I find the original argument to be fascinating and I do think it holds water.</p><p><br /></p><p>[USER=75143]@hotwheelsearl[/USER] [USER=81093]@AussieCollector[/USER]</p><p><br /></p><p>I understand your points regarding Constantine XI, but I have to disagree with them. I wouldn't read a ton into the Imperial Porphyry. Yes it was an old roman tradition, but it is such a small piece of the puzzle.</p><p><br /></p><p>Would you claim that Charlemagne is a Roman emperor too? He was crowned on an even bigger piece of Imperial Porphry, over 600 years earlier. Also, by the time of Constantine XI, Porphry came to symbolize Christ.</p><p><br /></p><p>Even if the Byzantines called themselves Roman, they didn't have any connection to Rome for 1000 years by time Constantine XI came to power. They also stopped speaking latin and switched the official government language to Greek almost a thousand years earlier.</p><p><br /></p><p>I know you already addressed the point on language, but are you saying that Byzantine culture and government were so similar to Ancient Rome, that they should be considered an extension of the original empire ? </p><p><br /></p><p>One last point on Constantine XI, don’t you have to actually rule an empire to be considered an emperor in the first place ?? I wouldn’t exactly call what he ruled an empire. By the time he came to power, his “empire” consisted of one major city and a couple of small provinces. </p><p><br /></p><p>It is also worth noting that Constantinople was sacked in 1204 and under the control of latins for nearly 60 years before it would be taken back by the first ruler of the Palaiologos dynasty. This creates even more separation between Constantine XI and the original Roman Empire.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>
[QUOTE="NicholasMaximus, post: 4514245, member: 111966"]Great Thread! I find the original argument to be fascinating and I do think it holds water. [USER=75143]@hotwheelsearl[/USER] [USER=81093]@AussieCollector[/USER] I understand your points regarding Constantine XI, but I have to disagree with them. I wouldn't read a ton into the Imperial Porphyry. Yes it was an old roman tradition, but it is such a small piece of the puzzle. Would you claim that Charlemagne is a Roman emperor too? He was crowned on an even bigger piece of Imperial Porphry, over 600 years earlier. Also, by the time of Constantine XI, Porphry came to symbolize Christ. Even if the Byzantines called themselves Roman, they didn't have any connection to Rome for 1000 years by time Constantine XI came to power. They also stopped speaking latin and switched the official government language to Greek almost a thousand years earlier. I know you already addressed the point on language, but are you saying that Byzantine culture and government were so similar to Ancient Rome, that they should be considered an extension of the original empire ? One last point on Constantine XI, don’t you have to actually rule an empire to be considered an emperor in the first place ?? I wouldn’t exactly call what he ruled an empire. By the time he came to power, his “empire” consisted of one major city and a couple of small provinces. It is also worth noting that Constantinople was sacked in 1204 and under the control of latins for nearly 60 years before it would be taken back by the first ruler of the Palaiologos dynasty. This creates even more separation between Constantine XI and the original Roman Empire.[/QUOTE]
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