After reading my grandsons home work the other day I learned the following (which will change my collecting habits) : "King Leopold II of Belgium was responsible for the deaths and mutilation of 10 million Congolese Africans during the late 1800’s. The spoils of modern day Belgium owes much to the people of the Congo River Basin. In the 23 years (1885-1908) Leopold II ruled the Congo he massacred 10 million Africans by cutting off their hands and genitals, flogging them to death, starving them into forced labour, holding children ransom and burning villages. The ironic part of this story is that Leopold II committed these atrocities by not even setting foot in the Congo. Such was the brutality of Leopold’s Congo that those who failed to meet the rubber quotas set by the Belgian officers, were routinely flogged with the chicote or had their hands severed (the chicotte was a whip made out of raw, sun-dried hippopotamus hide, cut into a long sharp-edged cork-screw strip. It was applied to bare buttocks, and left permanent scars. Twenty strokes of it sent victims into unconsciousness and a 100 or more strokes were often fatal. The chicotte was freely used by both Leopold's men and the French). The Congo was a playground for sadists. Rene de Permentier was an officer in the Force Publique in the 1890s. He had all the trees and bushes around his house cut down so he could shoot at passersby. He had women prisoners sweep a courtyard. If he then found a leaf in the courtyard he would have a dozen of them beheaded. If forest paths were not well maintained he would order a child killed in the nearest village". -A. Hochschild -Just a short recounting of Belgium and this miserable King's misdeeds. No more 5 Franc pieces with his mug on them for me!
I am curious what coins you could still collect if you only chose to collect coins with busts of benevolent rulers (rulers who hadn't committed atrocities of one form or another.)
I do not believe many coin collectors view him as good. If you don't want to collect his coins, then don't. It's very simple.
Plenty of so called "heroes" in American history would not be viewed so in today's train of thought. Andrew Jackson on the $20 is a prime example. I needn't go into why, you can google that. Some here collect Nazi era coins and banknotes, while I don't care for them and they creep me out - they are an ugly reminder of a miserable period for humanity.
I understand the viewpoint and the horror at learning about Belgium's 19th century African transgressions, but I also don't blame coins for a particular leader's malfeasance. Sometimes they can serve as reminders of just how bad human beings can become and a reminder not to repeat past injustices. Of course many people buy such things simply out of morbid curiosity. Nonetheless, such coins were also used by ordinary people who suffered under such regimes, so they have significance for the history of everyday commerce as well. Buying them now doesn't benefit rulers of the past, so I tend to lean on the side of moral neutrality when dealing with coinage from less than stellar rulers or states. I have coins of Nero, Franco, Turkmenbashi, Nazi Germany and other undesirables. Some I bought and some I inherited. I consider them objects lacking moral significance in and of themselves as objects. Others may disagree, which is fine, but I think one can own such things without supporting the ethics of the rulers depicted. Of course this ultimately comes down to personal preference.
There's a really good book about this called "King Leopold's Ghost" that I would recommend if you are interested. I won't offer an opinion on whether you should collect his coins or not, but as for learning more about history I highly recommend it.
so I tend to lean on the side of moral neutrality when dealing with coinage I like the phrase "moral neutrality"... And ultimately, I agree: that is the proper point of view. I guess I was exhibiting some moral outrage. I suppose I should have known this bit of history but was oblivious. One good example of his 5 Franc pieces will eventually be added to my collection. Other coins of the Belgian Congo I can collect with no problem.
You didn't do anything wrong. You were just expressing how you felt about a bad person. You are entitled to your opinion.
The same can be said about Ford cars, I won`t buy a Ford. Americans seem to forget or don`t know that Henry Ford published and distributed a four volume set of booklets in the early 1920s named "The International Jew" In 1938, Ford was awarded Nazi Germany's Grand Cross of the German Eagle, a medal given to foreigners sympathetic to Nazism. Ford did business with Nazi Germany including the manufacture of war material. Beginning in 1940, with the requisitioning of between 100 and 200 French POW`s to work as slave laborers, Ford Werke contravened Article 31 of the 1929 Geneva Convention At that time, which was before the U.S. entered the war and still had full diplomatic relations with Nazi Germany,
I guess the design on those Leo II 5 franc coins is as ugly as the man's disposition Interesting bit of history, didn't know it either.
You touch on an upside to this story. The images on coins can be a doorway to history. In fact, that's one of the reasons I like world coins, because they lead me to discover things I might not have the occasion to learn otherwise. I own a single Nazi era coin, a 1936 5 Reichsmarks, admittedly mostly for numismatic reasons, but also as a reminder of something horrible...something people should keep alive in their memories, rather than sweeping under the rug of time.
One thing that really interests me in coins is the opportunity to own something from the era and with the image of the most important figures in history, whether they are positive or negative influences. I have coins with Napoleon, Stalin, the swastika, and others. I have stamps with Hitler and Mussolini on them. It's doesn't mean that I glory in these people or what they represent, but they are important historical figures and I think it is neat to see them on a coin or stamp. On the other hand, I also have coins with figures like Churchill and MacArthur for the same reason.
Just FYI look up and read about the US and Philippine War of 1898-1902 if you want a genocidal war that touches close to home.
The movie itself isn't really that good, but the "Legend of Tarzan" that came out last year with Alexander Skarsgard, Cristoph Waltz, and Margot Robbie was set in the Belgian Congo of Leopold II. They don't show a whole lot of the atrocities, but that is the backdrop and setting of the movie, and they make mention of the state of the Congo several times.
This is a coin forum, and this very topic is about, well, coins. Take the political discussions elsewhere please. Christian
Up to you of course, but in my opinion there is a difference between collecting coins that were once issued by dictatorial or otherwise bad regimes, and "supporting" a regime by buying its surcharged collector coins. Example from around here: Many coins from the German Democratic Republic (East Germany 1949-1990) were made primarily for "Western" collectors who would pay in DEM, USD, etc. for such coins. So one may say that, before Nov-1989, buying such coins supported the communist system. Yes, Leopold's colonialism was certainly atrocious. And I am sure that you will find other coins issued by or honoring people who we find despicable. Again, coins alone will not teach you much about history - but they are fun "invitations" to learn more. Christian
I did not know of the Leopold II history until I collected coins and read up on it. Many coins have a truly disturbing historical backdrop. Shockingly so sometimes. I agree that collecting historical coins does not equate to an endorsement per se, or a positive interest, or any kind of like-minded thinking. Heck, some of my favorite coins are from pre WWII/WWII Japan...yet I can recognize the atrocities of the time. On the other hand, I am willfully choosing to divest myself of my 'collectible bullion' type thinking. I'd rather NOT be supporting some modern countries with my dollars given their current practices and decided I don't need 'pretty bullion'. But, we all have a personal line we can't cross. I just put a bid in on a medal honoring the war veterans of France (1930s era)--really cool design, but there were plenty of atrocities committed by many troops. I did NOT put a bid in on another medal--the epitome of a sleek Art Deco design that I love. Artistically, it's gorgeous. However, it has Mussolini on it. Just Can't Buy It. Leopold II may be too much for you on a personal level now that you know more of his history. It's very individual and there is no one answer suitable for everyone.
