Stupid Numismatics

If it is sealed, and when the copper is checked once or twice a year, if it is still the copper color , you can go for decades. If you don't check or don't replace ( as plastic can crack) and the copper goes dark, so will the cent. Oddly enough perhaps, I have silver rounds in a similar but larger plastic container and the copper strips really slow down the tarnish. But tarnished silver can be quite acceptable. But I live in a desert and not Florida type.

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I felt the same way you so eloquently stated right here. Then my attitude changed. I was also unable to fill all the holes. I was not able to afford to fill a specific hole (think to 1995 W).

My frustration with the Mint turned into appreciation. Why appreciation you ask? Because of the Mints utter disregard for the true collectors in the hobby I have completely, 100%, ceased buying anything from the Mint years ago. They inadvertently, unintentionally, and thoughtlessly saved me a boatload of money.

Thank you US Mint for making me open my eyes. Even the coins, sets, commemoratives, you offered that I did buy (think 1970's-current proof and mint sets) have lost almost all value. I can literally open the sets from most of those years and spend the coins for face value and not lose numismatic 'value'.

 

Also of note, even the TPG only guarantee RD coins for so long, right?

 

I have many, but not necessarily numismatic related, bit more focused on the selling/buying part.
*Restrictions on sending collectible/numismatic material abroad. Specifically those countries that make NO exceptions for any kinds of coins. I'm not talking great rarities, I'm talking common stuff mostly.
*Ridiculous buyers premiums from some auction houses, notably if the minimum buyers fee is a high flat rate!
*The recent U.S. mint...just about everything!

 

Yes, it irks me that NGC wouldn’t back its guarantee on brown Copper, which is stable if stored properly. I can understand that for R&B and especially Red copper because the darn stuff is fragile. That’s why I won’t buy old, red copper coins. I’ve had them turn on me really fast (less than a year) because they had been “enhanced” to get the color.

I am tired of the get rich quick people and their endless search for doubled dies. There has been a big market develop for those coins, however. To me, if you need a 10x glass to see it, it’s not worth much.

 

This is why there is Paint.....

 

Yes, I am sick of the U.S. Mint’s marketing games which maximize their profits. I am glad that I never got interested in the ASE set. It’s got to be really frustrating and expensive to keep up with it these days.

I would like two or three new mint products this year, the silver Proof set, the 2023 Peace Dollar in Proof and maybe the 2023 Morgan Dollar. Since I refuse to be a subscriber, who is committed to buying all of their overpriced material, including the “junk,” it’s going to be touch and go as to whether I can buy those items from the mint.

 

I have been running an experiment for almost 40 years where I put a few 1955-S Cents from a gem BU roll into different storage conditions, and have periodically checked them to see if they've toned. One went into an old coin bank (metal, screw together, not sealed) and the bank has been in various drawers over the years. The coin is still just as bright as the day it went in. Another went into a Kointain, and again just as bright as at the start. One went into a pressure-fit sealed plastic display container with a bit of foam, can't remember the brand, and it is a spotty mess. One is in an open tray in a drawer, and it has darkened a little but still a nice red. I didn't do any in open air. In 40 years they'd be quite dusty and I've moved at least 6 times in that period. Anyway, I'd conclude that a clean RD coin should stay red for many decades if some care is taken in its storage. I would agree that a slabbed coin, if it is still RD after a while in storage, it will probably stay RD indefinitely. On ther other hand, I've seen many "RD" coins in slabs that are spotty and tarnished and fingerprinted, but I don't think the storage medium is at fault.

 

The get rich stuff has gave too many false hope. Many of those come to coin forums and get mad when they get the real truth.

Next is the US Mint. All the games with the ASEs really ticked me off. I quit buying anything from the mint and ended all my modern sets.

Last are the actions of some new members to the hobby. They join a forum and in a short time they believe they are an expert and start posting false information that others believe.

 

WEXLER, CONECA and etc. who maintain a catalog of coin varieties that voids erroneous listings and subsequently reissues the same catalog ID to a newly discovered variety down the line.

 

I find folks who enjoy crushing the hopes of the new generation of collectors, often without any care to make sure what they have is actually not valuable. Happens quite a bit on CT, and even on CONECA. I've ranted before about this.

 

As someone who has built a nearly complete set of RD designated Lincoln Cents in mint state and in proof condition covering the last 93 years, nothing is more beautiful that an exquisite RD designated cent, copper and the newer zinc ones. I have 282 of these and about 40 to go, mostly mint state in the 2000s.

 

I agree with 1 and 3 but can't agree with #2..
RD, RB and BN make a major difference in the eye appeal of any copper.. compared to say Morgan dollars I see RB as similar to PL and of course RD more like DPL.. or more simply that bright red penny IS prettier then that flat brown one and should have designation and value above that flat brown coin.

 

Claiming everything that happens to a coin after it leaves the mint to be a priceless 'error'.

 

The problem is, some of these people refuse to learn. I followed one guy who kept posting parking lot finds, asking if they were errors, over and over. After a while it gets ridiculous.

If you are going to claim you found and error or a doubled die, you should make an effort to learn what they are and how to spot them.

 

The proliferation of cheap microscopes has compounded this. Because every working die was pressed more than once prior to single-squeeze hubbing, technically every coin from that era was a "doubled die." It's cool to find artifacts of it, but like you said, if you need more than 10x to see it, don't get too excited. I'm all in favor the knowledge we gain from it though - ultimately we could have every die pair from every series mapped out.

 

But I've seen many threads where the coin shown actually is a "real" doubled die, or some other interesting thing, and the poor OP got trashed and disrespected with virtually no effort by the poster to check the coin. There's one guy on here who's "title" or "status" line is something like "it's my job to disappoint you", paraphrased.

I remember testing this forum once to see how many such folks there are, and ended up posting the doubled die shown in my Avatar. Now, I already knew it was a doubled die, and was in the process of getting it listed (it has since been) but I got stupid comment like "there's nothing there" or "I dont see nuthin" or my favorite "you must post full images of both sides, and detail shots of the doubling and die markers, or we can't help you". Just plain stupid folks, not stupid because they are unintelligent, but stupid in that they don't know what a doubled die actually looks like, are arrogant, and worst of all when they post such tripe will likely discourage new collectors.

But I agree, I've seen a few belligerent newbies who deserve such treatment, yet not EVERY newbie deserves to be disrespected.

 

I went to the bookstore just last week to get the ANA grading book. The bookstore had a nice coin section actually…. But it was dominated by multiple copies of “Strike It Rich with Pocket Change”….. Legit bookstore chains even pander to this abomination of our hobby.

 

Maybe as a support, Someone with good background and studies of errors and mint productions could make a voluntary standardized post format for newcomers or those that have little experience with determinations where blanks as to what they think it is, and have area to post photos or drawings that experienced members could comment on. Many do not usually show the obverse and reverse photos completely as they may not recognize the significance, especially with die deterioration doubling which is very often the problem. Some may think that the
member would feel badly about a form. Just a thought. Jim

 

So to support my previous comment:

I don't mind RD, RB, or BN cents. I do mind paying the premium for the color designation. I think it is rather silly...and that is sort of the mindset of what brought this thread on. I'm looking for a cent. MS 65 BN was $65 whereas MS 65 RD was $180. That sort of jump in price, not grade, just because of a color designation is silly to me. Each collect their own way, but for something that will eventually turn to BN, I'm going to go with BN.