Should we wash dirty laundry in public or in private?

So true. And I am surprised that nobody has touched on this as yet, but are we talking about potential fakes or tooled, etc, that are for sale or just we personally have? It is extremely bad form and likely damaging to the hobby to publicly question items that are currently at auction/sale (with a link or other identifying information). Sure, we can copy and paste an image of a coin for sale without any other information and ask the question. But it is another situation to say, "Ken Dorney has this coin on his site and I think it may be fake" (or some other iteration). Personally I think its fine to ask the question and post pictures, concerns, etc. But its another to say "this is on CNG now, and I dont know, what do you think?". We all need to be careful. I am amazed sometimes how many members condemn a perfectly genuine coin and in another discussion advise a horrible fake is OK. It has been already discussed how we should back up our comments. Thats good policy. I have no problems with any post asking about authenticity (or tooling, smoothing, etc), but it should not be done with a link or obvious direction to a coin for sale. We are all sometimes wrong (me as well), and our comments can have a negative impact on someones livelihood. Now, having said that, one may suspect my comments as I am a dealer. No, I am not aware of any discussion regarding anything I have for sale or ever have sold, but I do see how it can have a negative impact.

So, bottom line, I feel keep the comments coming. There is nothing wrong with the free exchange of ideas, opinions, etc., but we all must be careful in how we present.

 

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I agree that everyone should feel comfortable to ask about, and reply to, threads about a coin's authenticity. Sharing knowledgeable, (and even unknowledgeable) observations and opinions about coins is almost always a good learning experience, as long as it's done diplomatically and tactfully.

It's always been my experience that being as specific and objective as possible minimizes the possibility of both misinterpretation and personal affront. Using examples, showing portions of pictures to support one's opinions, etc., are the best way to accomplish this. Taking the time to review and revise a post for clarity (as well as grammatical errors!) decreases the chance for confusion -- that "Huh? What the hell does he/she mean by that?" reaction when you read a confusing post about a coin's authenticity.

Finally, before clicking POST REPLY always ask yourself "If this were my coin would I feel insulted or attacked if I read this response?" If the answer is even "Maybe" then don't post it until you've revised it. While it's natural and somewhat inevitable for the coin's owner to feel a little bit sensitive about negative opinions, specific and tactful negative responses will almost always be understood for their usefulness.

 

If a coin is currently for sale with a dealer I always contact the dealer directly with a polite email with my evidence. The larger dealers originally lost my messages in the noise but this can change over time. I NEVER expose the dealers in public but have added their images to fake reports given their permission.

I am more concerned about posts in a board like this.

I have many PM discussions on fakes that never make it to the public domain.

If all the notifications were PM only then the fake coin might be taken as genuine by others if the owner doesn't update the status somehow. I have seen this several times. This doesn't bother me particularly because it's up to the owner who may feel embarassed at one of their own being outed.

More often than not I post strong evidence in public because this possibly educated more people but I realise this might not be ideal for the owner.

After the mix of responses here I am edging more towards private discussion first and asking permission of the owner before going public.

 

Martin => you seem to be one of the "Aces" on coin-fakes (my buddy Batman, being my solid go-to guy) .... I have zero-problem with you guys swooping-in and posting examples of "known-fakes"

... that is always a trump-card that seldom gets challenged!!

Keep-up the fantastic coin-defense (we rely on you, my friend!!)

Cheers

 

There is a spectrum to the coins people post on here. There are the obvious, horrible fakes that newbies post frequently. Gently letting them know and steering them towards safer places to buy coins and learn about them is doing them a favor.

it gets much trickier when the not obviously fake but not obviously real (if there is such a thing anymore given ancient coins being restruck with transfer dies). This is where I feel you need something more than "looks wrong to me". I am with Steve in finding this annoying. I have been pmed by people telling me one of my coins is fake based on photos only to spend time and money (and risk shipping it) and have David Sear tell me no question it is real.

 

Trouble with keeping such conversations totally private is that a private charge still causes great concern to the coin owner, but a private charge is not up for public scrutiny. Others might have good reason to support the coin and challenge unnecessary suspicion. I suppose keeping it private leaves it to the coin owner to open public dialog ("Hey, someone thinks this coin is fake, what do you all think?").

 

From the point of view of someone who is (relatively) new to this hobby, and who has (admittedly) VERY little 'expertise' in all facets of the hobby, especially the area of "How To Identify A Fake", (and I can only speak for myself, but), I would like to say that, I appreciate the opportunity to post a coin (pre or post purchase) and ask the question "Is there a reason why this coin might be a 'fake'?"
I have done this a number of times, and from the responses (and the timely fashion) I have been able to return the coin and get my money back. Each time this happens (to me and to others) I learn more.
I do detect the 'frustration' in some of the replies, from those members who can see an 'obvious' (to them) reason for the call, but I can understand that everyone is different, and we are not all blessed with the diplomacy of Henry Kissinger, so I (try to) ignore the tone, and appreciate the input.
There have been times when I have shown a coin about which I have had no concerns, only to be told that it is a 'copy', or a 'contemporary reproduction' or a 'Barbarous Imitation'. All of this (while sometimes disheartening) is useful knowledge to the 'ignorant' hobbyist (like me).
So, thank-you, one and all, for your opinions, and assistance, (requested or otherwise). None of us knows everything; we all can learn.

 

I miss the good old days. By that I mean the good old days when I could buy what were then rare and unusual denarii of Septimius Severus from branch mints because so many dealers could not tell the difference. One told me that the coins I wanted were junk of poor style and another always listed them as barbarous issues so I could tell I was bidding on an Eastern mint coin even though his list was not illustrated. As the experts learned that the 'different' coins were different in a good way the deals based on the coins being barbarous dried up. Now we have that situation with Eastern mint denarii of Hadrian but this time I'm the one having trouble telling the barbarous from the branch mints. I don't always know enough to be sure but I often know as much as the 'experts' who tell me all they know and more. It is fine to discuss the matter but lets be careful to state whether we are working from expertise or hunches.

 

I was reading your post and was distracted by your great avatar. I swear I went to school with that woman! Now I want a 1793 cent.