Second Chances: Julia Domna "Four Seasons" denarius

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by TIF, Sep 3, 2016.

  1. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    I was absolutely delighted to see this particular coin in a recent Buy/Bid Sale, especially since the Buy price was significantly less than my losing bid when it was sold by CNG last year.

    A Julia Domna "four seasons" denarius has topped my Domna wish list for a couple of years. I bid high and hard last year-- higher than planned-- and still ended up as underbidder. Now I'm very glad to have lost it last year! I entered my credit card number as quickly as possible when this sale posted, fearing a mistake in the listing. Two days later the coin was in my hands :)

    DomnaFecunditasReshoot-RT.jpg
    Julia Domna
    AR denarius, 19.5mm, 3.17 gm, 6h. Rome mint
    Struck under Septimius Severus, circa AD 207-211
    Obv: IVLIA AVGVSTA; draped bust right
    Rev: Fecunditas or Tellus (Earth) reclining left under tree, resting arm on basket of fruit and placing hand on celestial orb; standing before her are four children representing the Four Seasons
    Ref: RIC IV 549 (Septimius Severus); RSC 35
    ex R.H. Collection
    This was a tough coin to photograph. It is very reflective. Perhaps the images I took without reflections show the details better, but I like having some brightness in the fields.

    ...

    Julia Domna became of the most influential women of ancient Rome.

    As a young unmarried Syrian woman, her horoscope supposedly fortold that her husband would be come king. Apparently the stars were aligned for her and Septimius Severus. From Historia Augusta, Life of Septimius Severus:

    "He had meanwhile lost his wife, and now, wishing to take another, he made inquiries about the horoscopes of marriageable women, being himself no mean astrologer; and when he learned that there was a woman in Syria whose horoscope predicted that she would wed a king (I mean Julia, of course), he sought her for his wife, and through the mediation of his friends secured her. By her, presently, he became a father."

    Horoscopes: ancient version of Match.com? :D

    Their marriage produced Caracalla and Geta. Her influence with them helped quell a move to divide the empire into East and West. In her lifetime she was honored with the titles Augusta, Mater Senatus (mother of the Senate), and Mater Patriae (mother of the fatherland), the latter two apparently unprecedented.

    Nicknamed "The Philosopher", she was a patron of arts and literature, surrounding herself with learned members of society.

    Her authority and prestige ended with the murder of Caracalla and she died in Syria, reportedly by starving herself but some scholars suggest her death was from breast cancer. She was posthumously deified.

    ...

    The reverse of the coin is the major interest to me. Her portrait is not one of the better types (on this or any of the Fecunditas "four seasons" denarii), but for some reason I love these reverses. I've seen more than a couple of fakes of this type too, so be sure to check the fake databases before buying this type. In particular, there is a fake in which the middle portion of the tree trunk is missing. That's the hallmark of that particular fake and once you see it, you'll be able to easily spot it again.

    ...

    As always, please post any related coins :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2016
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  3. Aidan_()

    Aidan_() Numismatic Contributor

    Awesome coin TIF, and as always thank you for the great write-up!
     
    TIF likes this.
  4. Nicholas Molinari

    Nicholas Molinari Well-Known Member

    I can't imagine that happens very often! Congratulations!
     
    TIF likes this.
  5. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    Thats a dream Domna coin I would love to have, great addition.
     
    TIF likes this.
  6. zumbly

    zumbly Ha'ina 'ia mai ana ka puana

    Wow, it's gorgeous! Another one from your collection to covet :D.
     
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  7. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Gorgeous! Superb and superior to mine:

    Domna Terra denarius.jpg
     
  8. Mat

    Mat Ancient Coincoholic

    It is interesting how some reverse types end up having some of the oddest/mucky portraits and some always have the best. But this is all coins, not just Domna.
     
  9. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    TIF and Roman Collector like this.
  10. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    Here's another early Domna issue with the FECVNDITAS reverse type. The denarius:

    Domna Fecunditas denarius.jpg

    Rome, AD 195, issue 6
    3.49 gm; 18.5 mm
    Obv: IVLIA DOMNA AVG, bare-headed and draped bust, r.
    Rev: FECVNDITAS, Fecunditas enthroned r., holding child, another at feet.
    RIC-534; BMCRE-46; Cohen-42; Sear-6580; Hill-137
    Ex Barry Murphy: http://bpmurphy.ancients.info/severan/jdrome1.htm

    And the accompanying dupondius:

    Domna Fecunditas Dupondius.jpg

    Rome, AD 195, issue 6
    10.61 gm; 24.2 mm
    Obv: IVLIA DOMNA AVG, bare-headed and draped bust, r.
    Rev: FECVNDITAS SC, Fecunditas enthroned r., holding one child, another at feet.
    RIC-844; BMCRE-494; Cohen-43; Sear-6639; Hill-126
    Ex Harlan Berk

    Cohen raises the question of whether the baby on the reverse is Geta and the older child standing before Fecunditas is Caracalla.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2016
    randygeki, dlhill132, WDF and 10 others like this.
  11. chrsmat71

    chrsmat71 I LIKE TURTLES!

    oh wow, what a cool reverse! i wasn't familiar with it.

    lovely coin TIF!
     
    TIF likes this.
  12. TIF

    TIF Always learning.

    Re-reading my writeup, I see that I didn't tell the truth :oops:. I guess it was like the children's game of "Gossip", where a story changes a bit with each retelling, except these retellings were mostly in my head :D. Eventually the morphed story stuck in my head, and this morning I realized how it had changed. Sorry for that!

    When the Buy/Bid sale was posted I saw the coin and thought it looked very familiar but at that moment I didn't realize it was the same coin I lost last year. It's true that I didn't even pause to check comps before putting the coin in my basket and checking out. I'd previously looked at every Domna Fecunditas up for auction in the last few years and knew the price was reasonable. I wanted the coin badly and did pay for it as quickly as my fingers would type, fearing that someone else was doing the same at that very moment. In these Buy/Bid sales, coins which are desirable and well-priced tend to sell as soon as the auction is posted.

    Soon after completing the purchase I did check comps, and then I saw the coin in CNG's archives. That's when I recalled that I may have bid on it in the CNG auction. For many of the "big" auctions, I make a page in my database for coins I'm considering, updating the bidding action every few days to get a feel for what might happen at the end (when I bid). I checked my FileMaker database and there it was. I was definitely willing to "overpay" last year! While it wasn't a cheap coin, the price I paid was more in line with comps.

    DomnaFecunditasBidAttemptOct2015.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 4, 2016
  13. stevex6

    stevex6 Random Mayhem

    TIF => congrats on scoring "the one that got away" ... it is an amazingly sweet reverse (Tellus and the four seasons is pretty fricken cool)

    :rolleyes:

    Nice write-up as well ... you and Mentor always make me smile (it's like you're telling me a bedtime story, and I'm always "right-there" with guys when you're purchasing your coins) ... you rock

    Ummm, sadly I don't have a denarius from "The Philosopher" ... oh, but as you probably already know, I do have this sweet antoninianus from J-Dom (you showed me yours, so now I'm gonna show you mine)

    Julia Domna. Augusta, AR Antoninianus
    Rome mint
    AD 193-217
    Struck under Caracalla AD 215-217
    Diameter: 23 mm
    Weight: 5.76 grams
    Obverse: Draped bust right, wearing stephane, set on crescent
    Reverse: LVNA LVCIFERA, Luna, with fold of drapery floating around and above head, driving biga of horses left
    Reference: RIC IV 379a (Caracalla); RSC 106a

    Julia Domna too.jpg


    :rolleyes:

    Congrats again on being so fricken awesome
     
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  14. David Atherton

    David Atherton Flavian Fanatic

    We all know how rare it is to get a second chance at a lost coin ... I'm glad to see you finally got this beauty!
     
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  15. Mikey Zee

    Mikey Zee Delenda Est Carthago

    Huge Congrats TIF!!!

    That's a fantastic example and I'm happy fortune allowed you a 'second' shot at it ....and for less:woot::woot::woot:

    Wonderful posts everyone, each with a terrific reverse.
     
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  16. AncientJoe

    AncientJoe Well-Known Member

    Great writeup, and congrats on the successful second chance!
     
    TIF likes this.
  17. AncientJoe

    AncientJoe Well-Known Member

    (Edit: Double post due to poor internet)
     
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