Saint Gaudens die crack?

Has anyone had experience with marks such as the one on pictured Saint Gaudens? Initial appraisal has advised that it is likely caused by a die error, and not a scratch. Apparently it lacks sharp edges that would be characteristic of a scratch, however I am only aware of a die causing a raised line, not not an indent like this. What are your thoughts about how this would affect the coin’s value?

Any feedback greatly appreciated

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Looks like it's struck thru wire.

 

Thanks C-B-D. How would you expect it to affect the desirability of a 1921 Saint Gaudens? I am very new to the numismatic world...

 

either a struck thru or a scratch

 

They're not as bad as lamination errors (the shunned step-child of errors - no one pays a premium unless they're hugely dramatic), but they aren't very collectable. Someone may pay a premium for it if it gets graded in a Mint Error holder, but maybe only a couple hundred bucks, max. That's just a guess, though.

 

Thank you

 

Thanks again

 

Where did you learn this? PMD in the form of a scratch or a gouge will often have coin metal pushed out and up along the edge which would hardly be termed as a "sharp edge".

Chris

 

Thanks Chris. Have met with a couple of PCGS dealers in Australia to get their thoughts. Yes - they mentioned the same as you too, but felt that actual indent is more of a smooth/rounded surface, and not a sharp edge that a scratch would leave too. I have not been in a position to scratch a gold coin before, so not sure how it would look. I initially thought that it was a scratch

 

Just because the metal is gold doesn't mean that a scratch or gouge wouldn't have the same characteristics as any other metal.

Chris

 

The wavy look makes me think struck thru wire as well. Maybe a file card wire.

 

It could be a defective planchet but I'm more inclined to believe it was struck through wire. Welcome to CT.

 

I have serious doubts about authenticity. This is a $50k+ coin. Strikethroughs like this on gold coins is generally seen as a bad sign because counterfeiters would polish the dies to keep them looking nice and occasionally leave behind fibers that get struck into the coin. The indent looks just like this.

Couple that with the weird luster, weird marks on the rims, and the myriad of depressions in the right field, I think we can conclude this is one of the Lebanese fakes from the 1960s/70s. It is still 90% gold, though.

 

The 9 digit looks off to me.

 

Thanks Typecoin. What are the marks on the rim you are referring to? Have come across notes about the Lebanese counterfeits, but I haven’t seen a photo of one. Would there be anyway of finding out what the features of the counterfeits are other what you have said?

 

Doesn't look right to me either. Miss Liberty's head is tilted the wrong way, the ray that comes up to her torch should almost touch it. Etc. Take a look at a real one at the PCGN site: https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1921-20/9172

 

True, and the value gap between a double-eagle-sized lump of coin gold and a low-MS Saint is fairly minor.

The gap between the gold lump and a low-MS 1921 Saint is... substantial.

 

For a 1921, I'd assume it would go in the other direction. There may not be any strike-through collectors who would be willing to pony up for a genuine 1921 Saint, and Saint collectors who can afford a 1921 would likely view the strike-through as an unwanted distraction. Of course, I can't really speak for either group...

 

I'm with JeffB, if it is real it is NOT a desirable coin and would result in a decrease in the value. The only way this would command a premium would be if you could find someone putting together a date and mint set of Saint-Gaudens double eagles with every coin having a error. An error collector wants the error and they are available on common dates so he doesn't want it. A date and mint collector wants "perfect/undamaged" coins so they don't want it.

 

What do you mean, "struck thru wire" ?