River of No Return Bird in the Tree (RNR BITT) Errors

Discussion in 'Error Coins' started by PacificFleet, May 29, 2020.

?

Which do you have?

This poll will close on May 29, 2021 at 7:50 AM.
  1. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 1 Golden Eagle Edition

  2. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 2 Osprey Edition

  3. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 3 "Extra Branches"

  4. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 4 Finch

  5. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 5:Medium blob facing right

  6. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 6: Medium blob facing left

  7. 2019-P RNR BITT Type 7 Sasquatch in Tree

  8. 2019-D RNR BITT (Discovered/Confirmed, 2020)

  9. 2019-S or 2019-W RNR BITT (not yet confirmed/discovered)

  10. None yet

Multiple votes are allowed.
Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

    Aloha,

    Hope that you are all safe and doing well. This post serves as continued intel on the hunt for these special pieces.


    As some of you know, the River of No Return BITT errors have been a significant point of interest for myself and others these past six months or so.

    Medical professionals have been tracking the Coronavirus, this author has been tracking (and buying) these error coins.

    Some of this information has been shared with others prior, but this post serves to re-establish and solidify the types and notable features of the BITT error varieties, expand upon past published information in this forum, and to relate key identification features related to these unique and special contemporary error set.

    I am pleased to announce (for all who might not have been up to speed), that the River of No Return Bird in the Tree Quarter is officially a twin 2019-P/2019-D error coin!

    Errors have been found from BOTH mints, proving that the variations in patterns have resulted from not just a single incident, but multiple dies and variations.


    The details and expanded list of types:


    RIVER OF NO RETURN "BIRD IN THE TREE" Error coins:

    2019-P Philidelphia Mint Error Varieties:

    Type 1: Golden Eagle Edition (Varieties I, II)
    Type 2: Osprey Edition (Varieties I, II)
    Type 3: "Extra Branches"
    Type 4: Finch (very small bird in the tree)
    Type 5: Medium blob in tree, facing right
    Type 6: Medium blob in tree, facing left
    Type 7: big blob in tree, facing right (Baby Sasquatch in Tree :D)

    2019-D Denver Mint Errors:
    Thus far all 2019-D BITTs are rare. Like less than 10 examples have hit the market, all from the original lucky discoverer in Utah. Two varieties exist. I have been fortunate to secure for my collection multiple of the original Denver BITTs and can confirm their authenticity.

    Thus far, all 2019-D BITT's exhibit designs comparable to the Philidelphia Type 6.

    2nd BITT variety adds a second confirmed identifying feature that the fellow who discovered it has dubbed the "Leaky Boat" double error.




    Not all BITT pieces are equal. Like the 2019-W quarters, a lot of pieces were dinged up in mint processing and didn't come out BU.


    For me, a well struck clear Golden Eagle Edition is far higher value than others. Any clean piece with BITT+Doubling is naturally worth more than it's 'normal' single error counterparts.


    Images to follow. Enjoy the hunt!





    All photos copyright by me. Written authorization needed for re-use.
     
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest



    to hide this ad.
  3. paddyman98

    paddyman98 Let me burst your bubble! Supporter

  4. paddyman98

    paddyman98 Let me burst your bubble! Supporter

    That is a really bad comparison. The medical professionals are doing it to save lives. Searching for worn die strikes is futile.
     
    Nyatii and Robert Ransom like this.
  5. Robert Ransom

    Robert Ransom Well-Known Member

    And this variation, B701-53A-601,101K, indicates the 70% MDD level w/die chip on the tail of the 9, visible using 700X magnification. :rolleyes:
     
  6. Pickin and Grinin

    Pickin and Grinin Well-Known Member

    For the final time. There is no bird in the tree. It's an IDB. And not a very good one at that. Spend em.
     
  7. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    If anything, they would be considered minor varieties and they are not worth the price to buy them.
     
  8. Oldhoopster

    Oldhoopster It seemed like a good idea at the time.

    I am curious as to why you say these are rare?

    It sounds like internal die breaks (die chips). It appears that almost every ATB quarter has some sort of die break. This is understandable, since the mint only has a limited time to strike each issue and has to do 5 new designs each year. By the time they figure out which areas of the die are weak and chip, they are already making the next issue. The timeline doesn’t lend itself to modify the design to improve die life.

    I think it’s an interesting project to identify the chips and the name is catchy. I just don’t understand why you believe these are rare and desirable. Minor die chips rarely add any additional value to a coin. @PacificFleet Would you please elaborate on why these are different?
     
  9. bditto39

    bditto39 Active Member

    The reason he thinks they are rare and desirable is the fact he has some and wants then to be valuable. I think many have been there and done that in the past, but some can't get past it. They are cool. I support studying them and identifying the stages of these breaks. I even think the name is fine since it will help newer numismatists who want to get into errors and varieties remember and look for them. But to say they are rare or push them to be valuable is just wishful thinking on a valueless group of varieties. One reason there may be so few is that noone has looked for them. I sure haven't. But I guess if these become a desirable variety people will look.

    One of the coins that solidified my variety interest was the "spitting horse" Delaware quarters. At first they were "rare" and people paid ridiculous amounts for a well-placed die crack. Now they are neat but not the "rare and valuable" coins their initial proponents made them out to be. Im glad they were discovered and I like them in my collection, but I had to accept that they are not valuable and not as rare as initially hoped for.
     
  10. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

    Everyone is entitled to their opinions and I respect that. Just reciprocate it, yeah?

    I may be a newer member, but I'm not a new collector.


    In reference to uncommon and rarer coins, it is not only a gross numbers thing, but also a ratio matter. Some folks may define rare as being a key date with under a million made. Others may define it as one in single digit populations. In my discretion, if 1/10,000th of the total coins made are errors, then it warrants consideration.


    There is a multitude of error coins from the America The Beautiful coin series and I have also acquired those too.

    Hope that you folks have a good day. Image files are higher res to will post them later.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  11. rascal

    rascal Well-Known Member

    I doubt if these die chip and die crack coins will ever be worth anything much over face value because the modern dies have to make so many coins they become all chipped and cracked up . All they have going for them is the fancy names some folks come up with for them. There are some really good true modern variety coins out there to look for like the doubled die and clashed die coins . Some of them are awesome and quite scarce. The 2005 P Bison clashed die nickel is really hard to find because it was easily seen and the clash marks were seen soon and polished off. I nicknamed them the peeing bison because one of the clash marks looks exactly like that is what the Bison is doing.When the mint workers polished this off the die they had to remove too much detail and created the awesome detached leg Bison die. So now we have two awesome easy to see varieties from the same die pair.Does anyone on here have any of the 2005 P clashed die Bison coins ? I have a few of them and thinking I may sell a few of them a little later on thru Ebay like 1 of each a die clash and a detached leg coin as a matching set.
     
    Last edited: May 29, 2020
  12. Collecting Nut

    Collecting Nut Borderline Hoarder

    Maybe things are different in Hawaii with coins and we don't understand but if you're using 1 out of every 10,000 coins minted is an error I would suggest you research further. The mintages of coins made are in the billions. For every 1 billion coins minted 100,000 would be errors. That's a high enough number that lowers the value of the error as it is almost common.
     
  13. rascal

    rascal Well-Known Member

    I doubt if die chips , die gouges or die cracks would be considered as error or varieties coins since this type coins are from normal die wear. If they were from major die damage then they probably would have a decent value later on. I used to collect these modern die damage coins with light die damage and I have lots of different groups of coins with each group being from the same die. Also I have a few large groups of doubled die coins , die clash coins and coins from severely over polished dies.
     
  14. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

    Photos as promised.
    2019-D Launch event specimen included for reference purposes.
    View attachment 1126476


    These photos were taken last month.

    Purely a guess, but if there are 478,979,878 total RNRs made (P,D,S,W,S-clad Proof, S-Silver, S-Silver Limited Ed, and S-Silver 5oz 'quarter dollar'... there are not billions of them.

    223.4M Philidelphia
    251.6M Denver (~58k released at Idaho Launch Event)
    787.4K San Francisco
    670.9K San Francisco Proof
    501.6K San Francisco Silver Proof
    13,381 Philidelphia Vapor blasted Unc. 5oz Silver 'quarter dollar' pieces (20k mint limit)

    Therefore, total production is an estimated 478,973,259 for all River of No Return Coins

    We got 475M potential coins to search to find BITTS in P and D.


    If 1/10,000 of them are BITTs, then we are looking at a variety of less than 1 million total coins.

    And 1/10 of the BITTs are 2019-P Golden Eagles then statistically there would be 48,000 out there.


    Should it be tossed? HA! Go for it. But coming from one who's been keeping tabs on these
     
  15. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

    More images to follow... 2020-05-16 16.31.09.jpg 2020-05-16 16.27.31.jpg 2020-05-16 16.03.09.jpg 2020-05-16 15.54.58.jpg
     
  16. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

  17. PacificFleet

    PacificFleet kama'aina collector

  18. Oldhoopster

    Oldhoopster It seemed like a good idea at the time.

    I don't believe die breaks are varieties. Pieces can continue to break off as the die is in service creating numerous different shapes and sizes. A variety doesn't change. Die breaks often change, so the are better characterized as errors.

    The ATB quarters have numerous die breaks on many issues, not just this one. The work you're doing sounds interesting, but I don't believe you should be calling them varities. Die State might be a more accurate term, assuming the breaks are isolated to one specific die which may not be true if the design is contributing to die failure.


    http://lincolncentresource.com/FAQ/errors_vs_varieties.html

    https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/1655/Variety-versus-Mint-Error/
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2020
    Danomite likes this.
  19. rascal

    rascal Well-Known Member

    Looks like all of these are from die chips. Die chips , die gouges and die scratches seems to be quite common on our modern coins probably it is because the dies are overused because so many coins have to be made.
     
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page