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<p>[QUOTE=&quot;TheRed, post: 2930986, member: 87080&quot;]It depends on how you view the short cross pennies of the Angevin empire.&nbsp; Introduced by Henry II in 1180, the short cross coins were minted under his sons, Richard and John, up until Henry III with the legends and portrait style undergoing minor changes. The coins are divided into classes based on style of portrait, lettering, and moneyer, which would then indicate the ruler under whom the coin was minted. Even these classes are open ended, and one of the largest, 4, spans Richard and John. A class 3 of Richard won&#039;t look too dissimilar to a class 5 of John, so in my view it&#039;s hard to say there really is a portrait coin of either John (ignoring his Irish coins) or Richard since they are based off of highly stylized representation of Henry II.[/QUOTE]</p><p><br /></p>

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