Relisted lots on auction houses

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Aetius, Nov 13, 2020.

  1. Aetius

    Aetius Active Member

    What are your thoughts on lots which hammer and then appear again months later with the same auction house? Am I wrong to be highly suspicious in assuming the buyer has questioned its authenticity and returned the coin?

    There is a case in point currently listed on Naumann. Let me start off by saying I have purchased a Tiberius denarius from them back in April and am more than happy with the coin and service. However they have an Otho denarius listed for auction 97 which hammered previously on auctions 92 and 94.
    [​IMG]
    I am in the market for an Otho and emailed them regarding this however they have not responded and I dont expect they will...
     
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  3. hotwheelsearl

    hotwheelsearl Well-Known Member

    I would guess that the previous customers weren’t happy with the coin overall, maybe not a clear sign it’s fake.

    could look much different in hand and house is too lazy to update pics?
     
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  4. medoraman

    medoraman Well-Known Member

    Could easily be they had bad luck with a bidder who didn't pay. I have known auctioneers, and non-paying bidders are part of the game. One on Vauctions used to list this as the reason a lot was being sold again, because the winner of the lot in the last auction never paid. I bought some of them at a better price than the first time.
     
  5. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    That might explain one previous sale. but two?
     
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  6. Cicero12

    Cicero12 Well-Known Member

    It depends on the house, but lots that “sell” may not have met a reserve, or else were bid up by the house itself. These lots will then reappear a few sales later.
     
  7. JickyD

    JickyD Active Member

    I have one around me that does shill bidding on their coins, and if they win they just put it up again on the next auction. I guess it's legal in North Carolina.
     
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  8. red_spork

    red_spork Triumvir monetalis

    There are a variety of reasons. Sometimes there was a hidden reserve and the coin didn't really sell. Sometimes a bidder fails to pay. Sometimes a coin does get returned for any number of reasons(misdescribed, fake, "authenticity unverifiable" by NGC or similar, etc., bidder just doesn't like it in-hand).

    I sold a coin recently that was returned by the buyer. While it was fully described as being entirely repatinated, he was not a fan of the look in-hand. I allowed the return as I basically always do when a buyer is unhappy with a coin. In this case while I felt it was fairly described and photographed, I would rather deal with a return occasionally than have someone buy a coin they don't like when they first see it in-hand. I don't advertise this, but I set my buy-it-now prices/opening bids high enough to account for this. Some auction houses have similar models and will allow returns occasionally from buyers they know. They may or may not allow a new bidder to return a coin because they ignored the listed size or whatever and are surprised, but a $500 or $1000 coin for a buyer who reliably spends a few thousand dollars a year might be allowed
     
  9. Carausius

    Carausius Brother, can you spare a sestertius?

    Auction sales are never "approval" sales, so the reappearance is certainly not because the winning bidder didn't like it in hand. Also doubtful it was returned as fake, unless the auction house is disreputable. Most likley scenarios are (a) that the coin was owned by the auction house and had a hidden reserve, or (b) that winning bidder didn't pay. Option (b) is a rare occurrence and almost certainly not going to happen more than once with the same coin.
     
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  10. tibor

    tibor Supporter! Supporter

    The winner might have hit financial hard times and is now selling.
    The winner found a better piece (upgrade)
    The winner is deceased and the family is now selling the piece and collection.
    I'm sure there are other scenarios as well.
    I personally have dealt with Nauman several times over the last 10+
    years and have had no issues with them except for the length of time
    it takes them to issue an invoice.
     
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  11. medoraman

    medoraman Well-Known Member

    Yes and no. The bidder certainly has the right to assert a lot is misrepresented in the listing or photograph, therefore returning the lot. This is why group lots specifically state they are not returnable, since this option is open for most other lots if the bidder feels it was misrepresented.

    Now, a bidder abusing this very well may find their right to bid revoked, but it's a common activity. I never have, but most friends I know have over the years.
     
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