Real or Fake Tiberius tribute denarius

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by Andres2, Jun 20, 2019.

?

Real or Fake

  1. Real

    12 vote(s)
    100.0%
  2. FAKE

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    I think its genuine but have some doubt about the private seller.
    no weight or diameter available

    livia 2.jpg
     
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  3. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper Supporter

    I don't know. The last time I tried to guess the authenticity of one of these I ended up with egg on my face. Turns out there's far more variety than I was even aware existed, so I leave it too far more experienced people to give their verdict on tribute pennies.

    Here's mine...

    87764q00 (3).jpg
     
    Jay GT4 likes this.
  4. ancient coin hunter

    ancient coin hunter Roma Invicta

    I would guess it's authentic - traces of flow lines in the silver emanating from the lettering suggest it is a struck coin, plus the flan crack on the reverse adds a bit of an air of authenticity. But of course wait for others to chime in with their verdicts.
     
  5. IdesOfMarch01

    IdesOfMarch01 Well-Known Member

    1. No weight or diameter provided for the coin.
    2. No possibility of examining it in hand prior to purchase(?)
    3. No money-back guarantee of authenticity provided (?)
    4. One of the most widely forged types of ancient Roman coins.
    5. "Private seller."

    What are the reasons you're even considering this purchase?
     
    Ryro, Cucumbor, dougsmit and 3 others like this.
  6. Bing

    Bing Illegitimi non carborundum Supporter

    Unless you know the seller and/or more information about the coin, I think you should stay away. If you take the chance, you should probably spend the money to have it authenticated by someone who knows their business, i.e. David Sear
     
    Dougmeister likes this.
  7. PlanoSteve

    PlanoSteve Well-Known Member

    Looks to me like it may have been a jewelry piece, based on marks I think I see on the reverse.
     
    Paul M. likes this.
  8. Dougmeister

    Dougmeister The Coin Scavenger © ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    Some real wisdom in these replies... read them carefully :)

    What drew you to the coin? The price? The coin itself?

    If you said "price", then that's another red flag.

    If it's one thing I've learned in coin collecting... it's "better safe than sorry" and "there will always be another coin".

    Wait... that was two things.

    Anyway... there are exceptions of course... times when you see a coin and you weigh the risk versus the reward and you throw caution to the wind and seize the day. I don't think that this is one of those times, IMHO.
     
    Ryro and lordmarcovan like this.
  9. Eduard

    Eduard Supporter**

    In my opinion authentic: funky colour, but reasonable appearance and faint flow lines.
    However, I would stay away due to that crack or fault top obverse field, and the potential that one day it may split at that point. You never know how deep that crack runs.
     
  10. Andres2

    Andres2 Well-Known Member

    Thanks for all your replies, I'm still waiting for an answer from the seller, about weight diameter and provenance.
    I checked the forgery list on FORVM . no matches.
    In the mean time there are now 2 bids on the coin , but its still cheap.
    Thats a serious crack indeed , something to consider, thanks Eduard
     
  11. Nathan401

    Nathan401 Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Supporter

    On a different note, I think the portrait is awesome!
     
    Andres2 likes this.
  12. Nemo

    Nemo Well-Known Member

    One of the most faked coins you can find.
     
  13. Roerbakmix

    Roerbakmix Well-Known Member

    I've considered bidding on this coin as well. The flowlines on the reverse seem convincing; it is badly scatched though. The colour looks a bit odd as well.

    Although there are no matches on FORVM, I decided to stay away due to the same reasons mentioned by @IdesOfMarch01
     
  14. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & odd Moderator

    If it is a fake, it would have fooled me.

    That's not saying very much, however.

    I have owned a grand total of two ever.
     
  15. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper Supporter

    Most likely it's an authentic ex. jewelry piece that is corroded from having been used as jewelry and being exposed to God knows how much cleaning chemicals and sweat.

    The reason I think is real is the edge splits, that look deep enough and authentic enough, despite us not getting a decent view of the edges. But I think I see enough there to say that's not a cast. If it were a cast the edge splits would look filled in. Also, the strike is way too sharp to be a cast. I'd expect more softness of it were a cast. It's just a coin with serious issues due to being treated roughly for decades.

    You are probably better off paying a little extra for a coin with less issues.
     
    PlanoSteve and Jay GT4 like this.
  16. AussieCollector

    AussieCollector Moderator Moderator

    I'm no expert, but it looks real to me.

    The colour is odd, but that could easily be because of the photographer as opposed to the coin.
     
  17. JSermarini

    JSermarini Member

    I have been very paranoid when it comes to Tribute Pennies. Over the years I have seen some darn good fake Tribute Pennies (and dozens of obvious ones). Over the years I also accumulated about a half dozen Tribute Pennies that I could not either condemn or authenticate. I sent them to CNG and they all came back genuine. I will be a little less paranoid in the future.

    It helps when you understand the varieties. Some fakes from modern dies don't fit any of the known six groups. This page really helps:

    http://www.forumancientcoins.com/NumisWiki/view.asp?key=Tribute penny

    Of course some engravers are smart enough to get the details right. Few, however, get the style right. But the details and style won't betray a cast fake made from a genuine coin.

    Andreas2 your coin appears to be a group 4. Struck from c. 18 -35 A.D., the most common group. I don't see anything suspicious about it, but you just cannot authenticate these from photos. Many cast denarii look fine in photos.

    Sallent Your coin appears to be a group 3 type, which is the rarest. Only about 2% of Tribute Pennies are group 3. There really isn't a big price premium for that, but I do bump up the group 3 a little. Group 3 is dated 18 B.C., which means it was struck early enough to actually be the Tribute Penny.
     
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2019
  18. Sallent

    Sallent Live long and prosper Supporter

    Sweet, now I know mine is group 3 and minted circa 18CE.
     
    Justin Lee likes this.
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