Questionable Toning?

I just got this one back from ICG. I bought it from an estate. I know for a fact that the coin was in a book for many years and was not messed with.
Does anyone have any further information about what "Questionable Toning" means? I have not seen that comment before.
I have been "lurking" on this site for many months and I have enjoyed the Forums and I have learned a lot. Thank You!

 

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It just means that they could not definitively determine it to be naturally toned. It looks like pretty standard album toning to me, but there could be other factors such as cleaning that wasn't mentioned on the slab.

 

Chuck S, posted: "I just got this one back from ICG. I bought it from an estate. I know for a fact that the coin was in a book for many years and was not messed with.
Does anyone have any further information about what "Questionable Toning" means? I have not seen that comment before.
I have been "lurking" on this site for many months and I have enjoyed the Forums and I have learned a lot. Thank You!"

Although the coin looks AT to me, I'd say crack the coin out and send it to either NGC, PCGS, or ANACS for another opinion. If I owned the coin, I'd sell it raw anyway.

PS Whether a coin is cleaned or not has nothing to do with whether it has toned naturally or not.

 

They couldn't determine if the toning was genuine.

Send it to ANACS, they are great with this kind of stuff

 

I have to ask why you, or anyone for that matter, would send a coin to ICG in the first place??? Aren't they considered low on the totem pole of TPGS??? Or has something changed??? Used to be almost detrimental to have coins in their slabs. Simply curious, not intentionally slandering the brand.

 

I just got back 5 wartime nickels from ANACS. All came out of the same coin plaque from an antique shop. They were all polished, (and I totally agree with that), but 3 of the 5 said they were artificially toned. 2 of them did not. The three were toned slightly more, so I guess they said that that was artificial. It doesn't make much sense to me.

 

As a defender of all four major services (I have various connections to three of them), I'll try to answer this:

Johndoe2000$, posted: "I have to ask why you, or anyone for that matter, would send a coin to ICG in the first place??? Aren't they considered low on the totem pole of TPGS??? Or has something changed??? Used to be almost detrimental to have coins in their slabs. Simply curious, not intentionally slandering the brand."

First, let's eliminate the experience of the authenticators/graders. I believe the services are equal overall; however, I will say that NGC is probably best for oriental coins and ancients.

That said, each service has good points and not so good points. These have to do with perceived and actual value in the slab, cost of service, speed of service, open to all submissions or must join a club, coins included in variety services, "look" of the slab, customer service, actual contact with a professional grader, goals of the collector, registry sets,...get the idea.

Since you specifically asked, IMO based on experience and not hearsay, ICG is the best choice with regard to many of these points. For example, call any of the top four and try to discuss the grades you received on twenty of your coins (twenty-five to thirty minute call ) with one of the people who graded them. If that is important to you, ICG is the winner.

A further example. Try and sell an ANACS, SEGS, or ICG coin for what the coin inside the slab is actually worth (after the dealer buys it and it crosses). PCGS is the winner here.

So, depending on how a small collector/dealer wishes to be treated and what they wish to do with the coin - keep or sell, that may influence his choice.

One other thing to be fair: I see over graded, under graded, and correctly graded slabs from every TPGS. I'll bet you do also.

 

Still is when you look at the sales that occur in the market.

 

Unquestionably.

 

Shame about the details grade but a cool find nonetheless.

There's some nice coins in ICG slabs so the price break is fine by me...

The slab is pretty rough on this one and polishing didn't fix it so I checked out their site to see what the reslab fee is. I may submit to PCGS and risk a downgrade (the lack of shield detail comes from the O-119 strike flaw...not sure how they'll grade) but I found ICG's price table straightforward and refreshing in any case.

 

This is not the coin in the OP; however, since you have posted another coin into the tread I should advise you not to crack it and hope for a cross. Looks like an EF-40 to me. Compare the details on your coin (in spite of the strike) with the coin in the OP graded AU-50. Not even close.

Also the OP's coin looks like it has a greenish sheen. Green is generally not a good color on a naturally toned coin.

 

Sorry, wasn't trying to derail the thread- just seemed like his question was answered and the topic switched to ICG. I would expect a 40 on this one if I were to cross and write it in as my minimum.

I'm more interested in just having a slab that doesn't have scratches all over the focal points because I like the coin. If the cost were roughly the same I figured a PCGS 40 slab might still be a better option for maintaining value ($25 for reslab w/ ICG with shipping) but I wouldn't feel much different one way or the other.

 

I didn't know you could request another slab. This one looks a little fuzzy in spots but not adjacent to the coin. Also, I am still learning how to take a photo of a coin in a slab. The coin has better surfaces when looking at it in hand.
Thanks again for all the good comments!

 

The key to having a new slab done on the cheap is to wait until you send another group of coins and include the reholder. I'm not sure but my guess is all the TPGS only charge around $5 for a new holder.

Unfortunately, if you have a slab from a service you don't use, my solution is of no use. Paying over $5 for a new holder due to postage is, well...

 

Agreed- that's a good call. Thanks.

 

I wanted to wait for more OP responses before asking this question, to not detour the thread again.
How long will it take before the market will accept all 4 of the top TPGSs are valued the same??? Should it be determined by the date it was slabbed???
The reputations for over-grading coins is not an easy one for folks to forget about. So another question; what is the price difference between a ICG graded coin-vs-PCGS??? I know, buy the coin, not the holder. I also know that a nice coin in a ICG slab is less than the same coin in a PCGS slab, at least that's what my understanding is/was.
Until the slab values equal out market wide, I'd still prefer PCGS/NGC to the other two. Of course if buying, I'd take the lower priced slab (same coin) regardless of the company.

 

Almost certainly never. The value gaps are widening not closing. There is a reason CAC only does PCGS/NGC and the answer isn't favoritism like some people like to say.

Depends on the value of the coin. Cheap coins a couple bucks, pricier coins it is substantial. Just go look at sales prices, it is impossible to miss that tread

 

Seems to be conflicting opinions about the importance of TPGS. Until there is evidence to the contrary, I'll stick with the top two. Will always buy the coin, not caring which slab, but if sending to a service for regular grading, I'll stick with the two.

 

I have a questions about this. Wouldn't cleaning a coin improperly cause the coin tone differently than an unmolested coin? Meaning if they used improper chemicals or didn't quite get all the chemical rinsed off after the cleaning.