question on mercury dimes

graded

NOT


rated.

 

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I was just going to post that.

 

Ripley, perhaps you posted that as a joke but on the off chance that you did not - - -

Full Bands refer to uncirculated Mercs (and high-end AU Mercs) that have a strong stike. A heavily-circulated Merc will not have full bands because those details (as well as other details) will have been worn away. So, when someone says a Merc does not have full bands they are probably talking about an uncirculated or AU coin.

 

I found this image at http://coins.calkinsc.com/old_site/doc/mag_bands.jpg



On the left the bands are not split - and not from circulation. The bands did not fully strike up (as I described in my first reply on this thread).
On the right the bands are split.

 

Hello Jim. Thanks for your comment. I am giving much weight to all the comments made in the thread. I do have the David Lange book, but haven't fully gone through it. It is difficult to understand how to absorb all that material - time I guess. So far, I've pretty much used it when evaluating an online sale; it's kept me away from more purchases than anything else.

And, yes, Doug's comment was surprising to me. I was under the impression that PCGS was the better TPG, although I have read in a Traverse book that NGC and PCGS are about equal over all.

I have had a membership in Heritage, but have yet to purchase anything from the site, and mainly browse eBay's auctions. I've been to a couple of shows.

I am very appreciative of the imput members have contributed in this thread.

 

I admit that on most coins that have a FH designation are probably 3/4 head at most , but there are those coins out there that do have a full head and to see a really full headed coin with fully struck shields is a thing of beauty and a rarity for most dates , the 1917-P is the exemption they are easy to find with a complete head and shield .




Hears mine .
Rusty

 

Yausers...nice

 

Saying that a designation indicating how well a coin was struck is a gimmick is a foolhardy statement. FSB is NOT a gimmick and has been shown to be true by several folks in this thread alone. Same for the full head thing. Obviously not a myth *points to pic above*. So even if that is the ONLY Stander with a full head in the entire cosmos, it makes it not a myth.

Anyway, which grading service is better is a matter of personal preference. You have supporters of all of them, NGC, PCGS, ANACS, ICG etc. Depending on the graders that grade your coin, wether they are sick or happy, wether they got some the night before or slept on the couch, wether Venus is in the house of the rising sun, all can make a difference and none have anything to do with the actual coin.

VAcookey is putting together a Merc book, and we have increased or knowledge a great deal while she has been doing that (granted, she knew NOTHING at the beginning, so she had a larger learning curve). As was said, definately go for the crispest seperation you can find. The middle band is the first place to look as it is the highest of the three, and most likely to get the least amount metal into that part of the die. So if it has weak seperation, no need to go further. If it has good seperation, keep on checking the coin. You save a lot of time that way IME.

And rzage, dude, I am finding your house and stealing that damn coin. LOL BEAUTIFUL stander.

 

And rzage, dude, I am finding your house and stealing that damn coin. LOL BEAUTIFUL stander.[/QUOTE]

Thanks buddy , but finding a 1917 - P fully struck is pretty easy , It's the type 2 coins that you really have to search out .
Rusty

 

That says it all. Look at almost every Jeff nickel with a full steps designation and you'll know what I mean. Usually they are weakly struck, but may have full steps. As for a fully struck SLQ, I've never seen one. Rusty's is super nice, but I bet my entire collection it has weak points elsewhere, even though it's head may be FH.
Guy

 

I know I am pretty new to learning grading but I will be honest, I find teh grading system to be overly complex and should be simplified. Besides, no matter what guidelines the graders say they go by someone will ALWAYS have a different opinion. That's why I just do not bother with graded coins. if I think it looks AU, XF, ext and I like it I buy it.

 

Hey, if you wish to look at it as a gimmick, your prerogative. If there are any weaknesses on that coin, they are piddly at best. A gimmick indicates that there is no value whatsoever to the idea. There is plenty of value to the designations. A Merc that isnt FSB is likely to be not quite as nice a coin as one with FSB. Same for full head. Does it mean the coin is all over perfect? Of course not. But a coin with these designations is a whole lot more likely to be perfect than one without.

 

You couldn't be more wrong, but it seems a moot point.

Besides, it's not about the coin being "perfect". The gimmicky aspect lies in the fact that these designations were born with the advent of the TPG's as one more way to sell the idea of slabbing. It's no different from the notion a green sticker makes a coin more desirable and demands a heftier price tag. Bottom line is, a coin is either fully struck as a whole or it's not.
Guy

 

Ohhhhhh nice shiney SLQ.... must have....must have....

 

coin, what makes it seem complicated is the fact that different coins wear in different ways depending on the metal of the coin, design and such. What it boils down to in very simplistic terms is the high points on the coin are going to wear first. Those are the areas to look. Morgans...hair above the ear, parts of the wreath, cheek bone, eagles breast. Kennedy...cheek bone, hair above and below the part, the eagles head and banner above eagle. Things like that vary between coins.

Then you look at how easily did a coin wear down? A buffalo nickel with a lot of wear and still barely readable date may be a good, where a Jefferson with that amount of wear would be junk. Its not so much complicated as it is there is a large volume of material to learn.

cole, I see now. You dont like slabbed graded coins. Im not sure why you and others are so bent against them, but oh well. One of the owners of a shop we frequent is the same way. Not a graded coin to be found in his cases. However, he has proven that what he puts on the 2x2's for grades are pretty much right on, so we buy from him. Thing is, he is the exception to that. In most cases, I am going to pay more for a graded coin than one some guy puts in a 2x2 and writes AU 58 on it.

 

Doug , see your point , it doesn't make the designations meaningless , just that the tpgs are too lenient with handing them out . On SLQs maybe they should have 2 designations FH and full shield . Most tpgs give the FH designation out to coins that in many collectors minds don't come close to a FH designation defined by SLQs Collectors . Time for the tpgs to tighten ther standards .
Rusty

 

No, I'm not against slabs at all. In fact I own quite a few slabbed coins.

I guess my point was, the OP was looking to get the best merc dimes they could get. A FB, like FS and FH, does not make the coin the best in that grade, by any stretch of the imagination. Ok, I concede, the designations may add value to certain collectors, as is evident. But a FB dime in MS 65 is not a better example than an MS 69 without the designation. That was the point. To the OP, buy the best struck coin you can afford. But if you chase designations, on often lower graded pieces, you'll be chasing your tail and never reach your goal.
Guy

 

I understand why some people are against strike designations. I agree that the fact that a coin qualifies for a strike designation does not always mean the coin has been well struck. And yes, there is some truth to the advertising tool/sales tactic accusations, Full Torch Roosevelts comes to mind. However, it occurs to me that most people who don't like strike designations, very much like well struck coins. And while it may be possible to find an example of a coin that bears a strike designation that is weakly struck overall, only coins with strike designations can be considered fully struck. Finding strike designated coins that are weakly struck does not change the fact that more often than not, a coin that is well struck in the area that is typically softly struck is a good indicator of a strong strike.

It seems to me that the strike designated coins should be subject to the old mantra, "buy the coin not the plastic". However, that does not mean the strike designation is worthless. After all, it allows the collector to narrow the search considerably. My point is that coins without the strike designation are by definition, not fully struck, and will never satisfy the strike conscious collector. Even if the coin has a hammered strike in all other respects, the strike designations are usually in the focal areas of the coin and your eyes are drawn to that area of the coin. For the Mercury Dimes (FB) and Jefferson Nickels (FS), the strike designation areas in right in the middle of the coin and impossible to ignore.

I remember the first time I saw the coin shown in the link below which is now owned by a fellow CT member. My first thought was that it was the most beautiful Mercury dime I had ever seen. My second thought was what a shame it was that the coin did not have full bands.

Wowee! This Mercury Dime Qualifies as a Rainbow and a Monster!

Just like marks in the focal areas of the coin are more important with respect to the grade of the coin, so too is strike weakness in the focal areas of the coin. Bowers concept of full details is certainly better than strike designations, but there is nothing stopping collectors from refusing to buy coins with strike designations that do not have full details on the remainder of the coins.

I personally like strike designations and feel that price premiums for these coins are definitely warranted.

Mark